It's funny (and fun) how we get so caught up with simple things.
Musicians do the same thing. A drummer friend of mine once said, "We have a tendency to make rocket science out of hitting things with sticks."
:-)
When building a site built sandwich beam or a large header, I rely on TB II 100%. Plywood and wood become as one. Never seen one of those break or even deflect past the camber. Most of the time, not even that much.
On another track, I am a big fan of the old school liquid nails, but about 3 years ago tried the polyurethane tube glues. They seem to hold like hell, fill in gaps well, and dry hard and completely water resistant. The only downside is the tendency to creep and for the glue to seep out of the joints. So for structure work, or for something you will mechanically secure it's great. Works well on the back of hardened masonite panels if you run into that kind of paneling.
Have you tried any of those PU tube glues?
Nooouuu I have not, did not know that they existed. Are they expensive? Seems there would be a lot of poly glue in one of those tubes. I do occasionally use the masonite panels, the ones with the decorative surface on the other side. I starten using that stuff 20 years ago in our kitchen as a temp application to simulate a tile back splash. It is still up on the kitchen walls above the counter tops and still looks brand new. Does the caulk poly have a faster tack?
about 3 years ago tried the polyurethane tube glues. They seem to hold like hell, fill in gaps well, and dry hard and completely water resistant. The only downside is the tendency to creep and for the glue to seep out of the joints. So for structure work, or for something you will mechanically secure it's great. Works well on the back of hardened masonite panels if you run into that kind of paneling.
Have you tried any of those PU tube glues?
Funny you should mention Liquid Nails.
My first below ground, tank farm, electronic liquid level inventory control and measurement system sold was to a Liquid Nails manufacturing facility.
Changes in EPA requirements made it less costly to build a new facility than to rehab the existing one.
In the SFWIW category, Sika is a major world wide player not only in marine, but also industrial sealants and adhesives.
There USA tech service is located in metro Detroit complete with an
800#.Have always found them to be very much up to snuff when it comes to getting application assistance.
Also, their distributors will work with you.
YMMV
Lew
No, I don't think so. I believe about $4.50 a tube. Liquid nails makes their version:
There is! And a little goes a long way with this stuff, too. The good news is that if you make a mushroom cap of glue at the end of the tube when you are finished, you can pull it out the next day and continue to use it, so depending on what I am doing, I can usually use the whole tube.
That is what started me using this stuff. I was putting up thin masonite bead board that was hard polished from the presses on one side, and finished "Glacier White" backed enamel bead pattern on the other. I had to secure the top and bottom and glue the field because the a brad left a dimple *ugly) in a perfectly white and clean finish. I covered the bottom of the piece with a beaded screen so I could nail there, and the top with a really small chair rail. No glue only joints in the field have popped or moved in about 5 years.
Not faster than regular solvent Liquid Nails. Probably just a tiny bit longer on the poly stuff.
I like the poly for a lot of things because if its viscosity. For example, weather is cool today. With LN, a nice bead must be mashed out as it will be thick due to the cooler weather. Temps (until it gets really hot) don't seem to change the poly much, and it is really easy to work with. A nice bead of the stuff squishes down nicely with little effort, and no spring back like I have had with LN in cool weather.
The poly dries really hard and is impervious to water. Old faithful LN dries pretty hard, and is porous, making it susceptible to water damage if used outside.
Both still have a place for me in the tool box.
Robert
Thanks for the info, I'll have to look for it and spearment with it.
When I was working in commercial work, we used an awful lot of "Sikaflex" and its cousins when pouring tilt panels. All the vertical joints were sealed with it, as well as the interior pad to panel connections. We had a company that did nothing else, and they drove up in trucks with 55 gallon barrels of that stuff on it and they used pneumatic caulk guns.
I think some of those guys were artists in their other lives.
As it is now, we use some of their products in waterproofing details. Between Sika and Sonneborn, I honestly can't think of better manufacturers of waterproofing products.
Robert
What is this skin you speak of? :-)
Seriously, is I take a little extra time with a glueup, I end up with higher viscosity glue not "skin".
Are you woodworking in the desert?
-Steve
With most common woodworking glues - yellow, white - the glue dries from the outside in. If you put a drop somewhere it will form a skin...push on it and fresh, unskinned glue gushes forth.
Yours is probably "higher viscosity" because it is a thin layer and the higher viscosity is because it has skinned. Higher viscosity/skinned is not good because it won't wet out the wood as it should.
Liquid Nails has gone nuts with so many versions of what I think is the same product.
I don't understand that marketing method but it sure is confusing.
snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:
"skin" could be defined as viscosity gradiant. In my experience, I do not notice any gradiant, just thicker glue.
Then again, maybe I just work quickly. If I don't think I can get an assembly together within 10 minutes, I try to find a way to get it done with sub-assemblies.
The OP initially asked (paraphrased) Gluing, one side or two? More often than not my glued surface stays open to the air for less than 2 minutes ... viscosity/skin seldom comes into play. It would probably be fair to say that gluing both sides buys wou a little more working time if you need it.
-Steve
He mentioned surface tension. Even pure water has a skin in that sense--some critters even use it to move about (google "water strider" for one example).
Trimmed for brevity...
I conceed that I did not address the surface tension interpretation of "skin".
I believe that assembling a joint would provide sufficient force to overcome surface tension a.k.a. hydrostatic pressure.
-Steve
The other half of that thought is if there's anything under that skin to squeeze out, it's more squeeze out than I like. Normally, I run a squiggle down each edge, and smear 'em to flat films with my finger. Each face is fully wetted, leaving very little that can squeeze out. I suppose if I put the same amount of glue, the same amount as for both edges, onto just the first edge, there should be enough to squeeze out. I dunno. I guess it could work, but just seems so hit or miss. You run a double size bead, and then smoosh it around blindly with the other piece. Too small of a bead means not enough glue; too much means lots of cleanup. As it is, I inevitably have to wipe some extra off my finger, or move some of the extra to a slight dry area. It could work. Just put on a double size squiggly bead, smoosh the two across each other for half the squiggle distance, and come back a full squiggle distance. It could work. It just seems so... so... imprecise? caveman?
Come to think of it, that's not the real problem. Flat straight edges are fast and easy, either way you do it. It's buttering up the biscuits and feeding their holes, or painting up the M&T that takes up time. There's not enough sliding room to do the smooshing around with biscuits, and none at all with M&T. Do you just clamp and hope for the best?
Surface tension is not hydrostatic pressure. Surface tension is a molecular adhesion effect that occurs even in the absence of significant pressure.
I understood hydrostatic pressure to the term for that molecular adhesion.
Thanks for setting me straight.
Steve
I am thinking that the old formula stuff is all the same as well. Maybe a tiny bit of formula change to stay clear of litigation, but nothing significant.
In a pinch, I have used all the old solvent based stuff for anything as needed and never had a failure.
Robert
I almost always just hit one edge except if I'm gluing something porous - like hardwood edging onto plywood. Then I hit the ply and the hardwood. (Except if it's wider edging - then I hit the ply, let it soak in for 30 seconds or so and then hit it again - and I don't put glue on the hardwood because I don't want to have to work to keep it just on the portion that will be attached to the plywood.)
That said, I glued up a long miter on site today and put a thin coat on both surfaces before clamping/taping. But for simple hardwood panel glue-ups I just hit one edge with just enough glue to give me just a little squiggly line of squeeze-out - not wider than say 1/16" wide on top.
Soooo.....I guess my answer is "it depends"!
JP
HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.