Garage works, Brian on LJ

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Brian put up a new video, I don't usually watch his videos, but I decided to see what he is up to.
I felt uncomfortable watching him with a chisel, and using a block plane, when he should have been using a bench plane...
He was twisting the chisel back and forth in a manner that showed he does not know how to clean out the waste.
I also thought the box should have had separators that were less thick.. it looked like a tank.
I know I am nit picking, but if you are going to put out a video of how to, you should be good at it. There seem to be a lot of people producing videos that are not very good. They have some good ideas (sometimes).. but woodworking was something that in the past you learned as an apprentice. And while that is not the case any longer, we all need to hone our skills before showing everyone else how NOT to do it.
I realize Brian may take offense to this.. Sorry Brian, but I felt embarrassed for you watching your cleanup with the chisel.
--
Jeff

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woodchucker wrote:

"pry" with it? Should he have made a "stop cut", and then cut to that--or something else?
I think a genuine beginner would not be able to follow everything that what was going on in the video well enough to copy all of the operations (and wouldn't have all of the tools anyway), so I can't claim to be upset with it. He didn't claim to be an expert, so it seems hard to be too picky (for me). If we must wait for someone to become expert in every aspect before they can make any videos, then we might not get any.. I'm sure he will value your constructive criticism. I know I would!
Cheers, Bill
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Bill wrote:

I watched the same video again and one more. To me, it seems like "safety" is the thing that mostly needs to be taught. A beginner could walk away with the idea that it's cool to be "cavalier". When I think back to my h.s. shop classes, "safety" is the one of the things that I'm most grateful for learning about. How does a beginner get those lessons? Blood? Maybe it's better if ones starts with hand tools...
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On 3/29/2014 9:30 PM, Bill wrote:

If you mean the twisting back and forth yes, otherwise prying is sought of ok... we pry when mortising, but we never twist when wasting... you just push forward, or for heavier work, you tap with a mallet. For this, you just push , and use your body for light wasting. For very light you use your arms. With a sharp chisel that should have been butter. Even maple just cuts easily for that. That chisel was treated like a screwdriver. A gouge on the other hand can be used that way.... well sought of, you can rotate the gouge back and forth to cut
I had no problem with his using a saw to stop the cut.. I would have just used a chisel strike. But that's a matter of preference.

the person the wrong way.. which then becomes gospel to the beginner because they saw someone they trusted doing it.

--
Jeff

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woodchucker wrote:

Thank you for the clarification!
Bill
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If that bothers you, you would have recoiled in horror watching Sam Maloof work.
--
www.ewoodshop.com (Mobile)

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On 3/30/2014 9:36 AM, Swingman wrote:

Especially when he cut of one of his finger tips.
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On Saturday, March 29, 2014 6:50:45 PM UTC-4, woodchucker wrote:

- I much prefer the feel of my block plane in my hand and it far out perfor ms 'my' bench plane in cut quality. - The block plane did the job that I needed done to high standards. The jo b at hand was getting the waste left by the jointer flush with the jointed side. This can be felt with a finger swipe to the thousands of an inch. S ome regions along the length need to be hit harder than others because of t he variation in the rough lumber. Some regions are not touched w/ the bloc k plane. A block plane is perfect for this.

Not sure if you noticed or not, but I had only 1/4" of material to the righ t of the rabbet. I had to be extremely careful not to blow that out to the right (front of t he piece). That is the reason why I cut the right side with a flush trim s aw. I needed to cut as much of the fibers as I could to help prevent blow out. I then used the chisel to 'lift and tear' the wood fibers and lift th em into the saw cut for removal. Very effective. This was the bottom of the piece. My ONLY concern was not blowing out the wood to the front. All that was needed was to remove waste for the plywood bottom.
It's difficult to tell at 600X speed but this process was done with great p recision and caution and was very successful.

The customer (wife) wanted 1/2" and this is what was delivered. I appreciate your opinion on this but I bet if you saw it in person you'd like it more.

While I was a little shocked to read someone trying to rip me apart, I took no offense, seriously. The fan mail I receive, on a weekly basis, from pe ople all around the world describing to me how I've taught them woodworking and how I've 'raised their game' far out weight your comments. :)

I've heard from people in the past that say, while I'm a good woodworker, I do not always follow 'convention' (here's one : http://froggybuilder.com/ index.php/resources). It's my opinion that the ones that feel this way are usually taught 'conven tion' from woodworking classes in a more traditional manner.
I'd agree that I don't always follow convention, and that my philosophy on woodworking isn't to make sure I am using the traditional hand plane for th e job, that follows convention, but to make sure that I am using the tool t hat will get the job done to the standards that I hold.

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On 3/30/2014 11:25 AM, snipped-for-privacy@garagewoodworks.com wrote:

larger area. A block plane works small areas, or chamfers. Like I said this may have been nitpicking.. And this was not that... critical. Why does your block plane exceed your bench plane, because it is a veritas block plane that cost more? or because the blade on your bench plane is not sharp. Or is it technique?

technique is horrendous. You can twist that to your sawing. I specifically referenced your chiseling. It was awful. Use the cutting edge.. Don't twist it like a screw driver.. It was ugly, and there was not a lot of precision the way you handled it.

--
Jeff

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On Sunday, March 30, 2014 11:41:48 AM UTC-4, woodchucker wrote:

ted side. This can be felt with a finger swipe to the thousands of an inch . Some regions along the length need to be hit harder than others because of the variation in the rough lumber. Some regions are not touched w/ the block plane. A block plane is perfect for this.

im saw. I needed to cut as much of the fibers as I could to help prevent b low out. I then used the chisel to 'lift and tear' the wood fibers and lif t them into the saw cut for removal. Very effective.

m people all around the world describing to me how I've taught them woodwor king and how I've 'raised their game' far out weight your comments. :)

r the job, that follows convention, but to make sure that I am using the to ol that will get the job done to the standards that I hold.

Maybe I wasn't clear. Let me try again:
I cut the fibers as I could to help prevent blow out. I then used the chis el to 'lift and tear' (TWISTING MOTION) the wood fibers and lift them into the saw cut for removal. Very effective. Again, this was the bottom of th e piece where plywood has to sit. My only concern was preventing blowout.
This was done with great precision and was very effective. Not sure why th is is such a sticking point for you.
My impression of you, based on what little I've read by you and your choice of words, that your goal here is more about attacking me than providing ho nest criticism.
Because of this, I feel it is pointless to continue. You may continue, as I 'm sure you will, to spew your garbage, but I will save you the trouble of looking for a response from me.
Because you responded so quickly to my last, I know you are just salivating to respond to this one.
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wrote in message
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 6:50:45 PM UTC-4, woodchucker wrote:

I would probably have done this waste removal in the same basic manner... This as it would have been real easy to blow out the short grain after the saw cut as the stop cut wasn't a full stop cut, i.e., it didn't reach the full depth of the rabbet. The saw cut was at an angle, much like you'd get sawing the pins for half blind dovetails, so you couldn't depend on a simple splitting action to remove the waste. You also couldn't risk chopping into the saw cut as it would have been more likely to blow out the short grain at the end of the board than it would compress the waste wood in the rabbet. That was a tense bit of waste removal... and it was successful. The emphasis here on successful. ;~)
John
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On Sunday, March 30, 2014 10:02:12 PM UTC-4, John Grossbohlin wrote:

It was a little hair raising. I probably should have explained the purpose of the saw cut. Sometimes I make the the mistake of assuming that the log ic behind certain tasks are obvious. When producing these videos, I run th e risk of too much commentary and not enough action. I 'think' I balance t his well, but maybe not; it's tough to please everyone, so they say, as mad e evident by this thread.
I am left vexed by how someone can criticize someones process when said pro cess is not unsafe, and produces the end result required in a reasonable am ount of time.
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wrote in message

This is one of those things where having some feedback helps you get it better the next time.... ;~) I've learned a lot from my "student's" questions when I've lectured at Woodworkers Showcase, or taught classes, or during may days interpreting at Colonial Williamsburg. It's the old story of being so familiar with something that you assume everyone already knows it or gets it.... That said, I've had some really off the wall questions over the years... I remember a teenage kid at CW who was totally dismayed at the question his father asked and his dismay was obvious to the entire roomful of people. ;~)

I think we all have an "Ah Ha" moment... For example, I studied the hand-cut dovetailing techniques of a lot of "experts" over the years and there is a lot of variance. I can cut them like Tage Frid, or Frank Klaus, or Chris Schwarz, or Roy Underhill, or like the "mirrors and 747 land light" crowd in the magazines. They will all give good results as long as you keep a few basic rules in mind. Whatever you cut first dictates what you cut second... and make sure you cut in the waste. ;~) To make that point I taught a dovetailing seminar one time where I used a different technique for each pair of pins and tails and it still went together the first time without fussing with it. One year I did the Frank Klaus approach, live in front of an audience at Showcase, with no sliding bevel or ruler or divider... again, it went together the first time with no fuss.
The "Ah Ha" happens when you see that there are often a LOT of different ways to accomplish the same thing. That was one area where Norm Abram did a good job over the years.... he used different techniques across shows to accomplish the same task.
It's all good...
John
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I did.
My first thought, watching him holding a router in one hand and the workpiece in the other was "What an idiot. Doesn't he know what clamps are for?".
Then I saw his left hand ... and realized, no, he doesn't.
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Hi Brian,

I've been watching your videos for a long time and enjoyed the desk organizer video too. I don't know why other posters have such an issue with your techniques. There's more than one way to get a job done, and everyone has their own way of doing things. I didn't see anything that looked dangerous or foolish to me.
Many of us don't own an assortment of planes. I only own a small block plane and rarely ever use it. I would probably have done something similar to what you did, or would have figured out some way to accomplish the task with a router (maybe a flush trim bit). Actually, I don't even own a jointer, so I would probably just use my planer (with a sled if needed). All that matters is you ended up with a flat surface.
I have a small assortment of chisels, but have never taken time to sharpen them. So I have to work a little harder than someone with more experience might. It's just not something I do enough that it concerns me.
In any case, keep doing what you're doing. I find your videos enjoyable and, like most woodworking videos, I usually learn something new. Seeing how different people handle a task is more valuable to me than watching the established proper method.
Keep up the good work!
Anthony Watson www.watsondiy.com www.mountainsoftware.com
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On 3/30/2014 1:36 PM, HerHusband wrote:

a dull tool is the most dangerous tool. You have to put so much more pressure and effort into cutting. And that is what a chisel does cut... not pry and tear the waste to precision.
So I have to work a little harder than someone with more experience

--
Jeff

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Sorry, but that just sounds like excuses. If you aren't working with sharp tools, they are not only dangerous to you but to the workpiece. You will have no feel of the wood, tearing instead of slicing.
I taught my kids from the time they could walk that the most dangerous tool is a dull tool. There are good reasons for that.
djb
--
³Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness
sobered, but stupid lasts forever.² -- Aristophanes
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On 3/30/2014 9:10 PM, Dave Balderstone wrote:

and fly... A sharp tool does the job safely.
--
Jeff

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On 3/30/2014 9:10 PM, Dave Balderstone wrote:

My sharpening stones are in the house. I can sit and watch TV or listen to music while sharpening.
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"Mike Marlow" wrote:

It's been a slow day in the news room.
Lew
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