I'm looking at the S2 dining table, its a clean design I like but at $6k?
Why so pricey for something this simple that I could make in a couple of
days or am I living in the past?
Make one yourself. If you can make one for less money considering the value
of your time and cost of materials you will be dollars ahead and for some
people, that would not be possible.
If you are a decent wood worker you may be way a head of the game building
it yourself. If you are not a wood worker, if you can explain why a
surgeon charges so much you might come up with a similar type answer.
Simple looking is very often a result of good planning and honed skills.
If everyone could do everything that everyone else does everything would be
Another point: I buy ready-made legs and fittings and can put together
a dining table or coffee table with a country finish in a day or two
including finishing, and they certainly are better than the cheap
tables I can buy, and as good as the mid-priced stuff - and less
expensive than both. However, to compare my tables to the high-end
stuff would require better quality materials, better quality finish
and some changes in construction. Personally, I have found the
procurement, and quality, of materials is nearly always the biggest
problem. Now, SWMBO would argue that I have other problems but that's
a completely different topic.
Having recently completed my own solid cherry dinning table, I can speak
Except for the table tops... all of the designs on the site have no seams
(drawer fronts and such are not made from glue-ups) and no descenable wood
defects. If you want to replicate that look, expect as much as 50% waste
when purchasing that wood.
I did, and I had close to $1000 in wood and supplies into my table. I had a
somewhat more complicated design, but had over 100 hours into it. I think "a
couple days" is unrealistic.
Is $6K alot? Sure but, it's not that crazy. I could not afford that kind of
money for a a table, but I have the skills and equipment.
According to my casual research:
<$1000 buys you man-made wood products (veneered whatever) or low-end slolid
woods that do not grow in this hemisphere.
$1500-$2500 gets modest-design indiginous common hardwood (oak, maple,
perhaps some cherry) with not much, if any, attention paid to grain matching
or stock selection.
Above that.... you pay for premium hardwoods, premium wood selection and
more complicated designs.
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
No way you could build it as a one-off in two days. The devil's in the
details. Look at the legs. The mix of straight sections for mortising
and sweeping curves would take half a day to work out (at least one
prototype if not two) then if you are very lucky half a day to cut the
legs out and shape them. Figure a full day to build up the top and
mill straight sections. Depending on how you are going to do the
joinery figure half a day minimum for that. Up front you likely had a
day in buying or finding/sorting, surfacing and matching the stock.
Now figure at least half a day to prep for finish ( a day or more if
you really care about the finish) and three half days of finishing.
So that adds up to something like six days -- if you are ambitious,
cut corners on the joinery, and do only the minimum required surface
prep. At $6k they are proud -- but if you don't have the tools or
the know how it's not an unfair price.
On the other hand maybe I work way to slowly.
Does it pay Tiger Woods to mow his own lawn? Your ability to earn your
living at your chosen profession should tell you what your time is
worth per hour. That should be factored into your estimate of the cost
of the item. Projects with clean "simple" lines may be harder to
fabricate than they appear .However if its the pleasure of building it
you seek, by all means go for it. The perceived saved money should
not be the only incentive.
There have already been a bunch of good replies . . . all appropriate.
One issue not mentioned yet though is that this is a company that is in
business to make a profit . . . to amortize equipment, provide workmens
comp, pay overhead for a commercial effort . . . hire and train
employees etc. Six grand is a lot, but not at all out of line assuming
this is truly a quality product.
-->At Green Design Furniture, a method of manufacturing furniture was
developed using the inherent strength of the wood itself to hold the
furniture together. It is a system of interlocking joinery that allows
the parts to slide and lock into each other, using full-length
dovetailed connections. This innovative system, developed and patented
by Douglas Green, virtually eliminates the use of screws, nuts, bolts,
and other fasteners.
What's innovative about sliding dovetails? It's rather presumptive to
claim that they developed it. And how in the heck can you patent
something that's been in common use for centuries?
Anyhow, to do a one-off copy I reckon it would take me at least 40
hours (not counting the design, picking up lumber and supplies, and
fixing mistakes) and probably $500 US for supplies. Even if it took
me 100 hours and I paid myself $50 per hour I'd still come out ahead
of their price. On the other hand, you gotta figure in the cost of
all of those tools, shop space, etc. Actually, at this point, there
is no way my wife would permit spending that much money on the table
when she knows that I could build one at much less (unless, of course,
I sold my tools to pay for it)
Knock yourself out but I question your estimate. The table has curved
tapered legs, curved cross sections, at least 12 M&T joints, optional
extension leaves in what appears to be cherry. For artisan pieces of
this nature, $6K is not unrealistic.
It's about $1k to make it, $1k to finish it, and $4k to run the sort
of shop where people who spend $6k on tables like to buy them.
Yes, you could make it. But they get the money because they know how
to _sell_ it too.
If I had $1 for every time some woodworker quite reasonably says "I
could make that", then I'd have a lot more $ than I ever had trying to
sell $6k tables to people who bought them instead of making their own.
Thu, Feb 8, 2007, 5:19am (EST-3) firstname.lastname@example.org (Jack) doth posteth:
I'm looking at the S2 dining table, its a clean design I like but at
$6k? Why so pricey for something this simple that I could make in a
couple of days or am I living in the past?
Yeah, but how many are they selling at that price? Of course
there's always someone with more money than brains.
I betcha I could make a more money selling a gizmo at $100 each over
trying to selling them at $1000 each.
Only those who have the patience to do simple things perfectly will
acquire the skill to do difficult things easily.
- Johann Von Schiller
On Thu, 8 Feb 2007 14:41:46 -0500, email@example.com (J T)
They guy's Web site says that he limits production to a thousand a
He hasn't learned the adage "sell to the classes you'll live with the
masses, sell to the masses you'll live with the classes". And he
doesn't charge near enough for it to become a status symbol.
I suspect that he's hoping that he can sue somebody into licensing his
I'm working on a patent for something I'm calling the "glueless butt
joint". I am not going to tell you how it's done but I will give a hint:
It uses headed long cylindrical metal pieces which are inserted through
the joint by the impact from a piece of heavy iron on the end of a stick.
I also intend to patent the cylindrical metal pieces and the iron thingy
too. I just need to come up with a name.
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