Frustated and Looking for help


Hi All, So I have been working on some handcut mortises again, and keep getting frustated with my chisels, hoping someone might have some info to help.
I bought a handful of Hamlet Crafttools mortise chisels last year, and have used all of them off and on. I have noticed with the larger sized ones (5/8 and 1") I can't seem to get an edge to hold, they roll over within minutes. Today I dutifully sharpened the 5/8" prior to using, and before I had even made the first pass on the first motice in 8/4 cherry the edge was starting to roll. I am using Norton stones, and the MKII honing guide from lee valley, dialed in to 30 degrees. I seem to recall someone posting recently that they had noticed that with newer chisels sometimes it takes a couple sharpenings before the steel seems to hold at all. So what the hell I though, and went down to 220 for a while, then back up through 8000, nice edge though with a much more pronounced wire that had to be removed. Once again I start chopping, only to have the damn thing roll again.
Is there something I could be doing wrong? Am i expecting too much? Or is this a case where I should have spent 80 bucks rather than 45 to get some decent steel.
Either way I'm annoyed and wondering if I can return the damn things a year after i bought them...
Thanks in advance for any thoughts
Andrew
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Andrew, if you put a secondary bevel of 20 degrees on your mortise chisels that will take care of your problem.
Tattooed and Dusty wrote:

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On 14 Nov 2005 17:45:09 -0800, "Tattooed and Dusty"

that was me. in the cases where I have seen this, the edge didn't roll, though- it looked more like chipping, or even like metal had been torn out of the tool. the kind of thing you'd expect from brittle steel.

sounds like the steel is too soft to hold an edge. your options-
sharpen very frequently. use these as utility chisels and get better for chopping. return them and get better. have a go at hardening and tempering these.

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If the edge is rolling rather than chipping, they are soft.

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Hi All, Thanks for the initial round of comments. Can anyone recommend some mortise chisels that this won't happen with? Are Ray Illes the ones to trust?
What would be involved with tempering these to make them harder, or is that a dream?
Andrew
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I have one ECE mortise chisel of very good quality.

If I make some tool that needs to be hardened I heat the steel in a charcoal fire (think BBQ grill with a small fan) to a dull red (should be around 850 degrees celsius) and quench quickly in a bucket of water, but then I only use tool steel thats good for water hardening, some of the oil hardening wil crack if they are subjected to the quick quenching that happens in water (oil quenches slower!). After that I annael them for 2 hours at 200 degrees Celsius in the stove to relieve internal stresses and bring the hardness down from overly brittle to a good working hardness.
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On 15 Nov 2005 08:40:58 -0800, "Tattooed and Dusty"

you'll access a better group for that question over at rec.crafts.metalwork
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rec.crafts.metalworking
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On Tue, 15 Nov 2005 11:18:08 -0700, "Charles Spitzer"

thanks :)
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