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Eagle Scout project complete!

So it is your belief that some action on your part can result in a change in God's plan?

Reply to
J. Clarke
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I never said there was "nothing." The hereafter simply doesn't influence me.

By the simple standard rules of logic, I can say that we MIGHT be closer to world peace, a cure for cancer, or eliminating male pattern baldness had not some really great intellects applied themselves to endeavors other than ruminating on how many angles could dance on the head of a pin.

The New Testament says that the streets of heaven are paved with gold. Whether they're paved with gold or whether they're paved with mud, they are what they are and none of our piety or wit can cancel half a line. We are of THIS world, not the world to come.

But, and this is a big "but," to the degree that any faith inspires and comforts, any activity that promotes that faith and belief is, intrinsically, good. Any religion that promotes charity, good works, justice, respect, protection of the weak and chastisement for the wicked is a good and holy road to God - even if it digresses from time to time to contemplate angles and pins.

Reply to
HeyBub

Doug, you have a fine young man for a son, anyone who says different is a jerk. I wish there were many more young folks like you son out there. I understand your pride and your wish to share it. You have every right to brag, perhaps you had a little bit to do with it. *snicker*

TDD

Reply to
The Daring Dufas

It's my understanding they left no unused firewood behind...

Reply to
Larry Kraus

Thank you.

I actually had very little to do with the project. My role could be described as "technical consultant" perhaps -- things like suggesting that reducing the planned width of the box by 1/4" made it possible to cut all fourteen backs out of one sheet of plywood instead of two; likewise for the plexiglass fronts. I showed him how to plan his cuts on the table saw to minimize the need to change setups. I told him he ought to use stainless steel nails, not galvanized, in cedar, and why. I showed him how to make simple jigs to make sure cuts were made, and holes were drilled, in consistent repeatable locations.

But he came up with the idea, he planned the project, he raised the funds, he bought the materials (or arranged for them to be donated), he made *all* the saw cuts, he organized the team of volunteers to assemble the boxes, he directed them. He made sure the "Call Before You Dig" folks marked the area so the post-hole auger wouldn't hit any buried utilities. He talked the owner of a construction company into drilling the holes for him, and showed him where to drill the holes, and how deep. He supervised the final assembly and installation of all fourteen stations. He hired a local engraving company to make the brass "In memory of..." plaques, and kept careful track of who had endowed which station, to make sure the plaques wound up on the right posts.

Yes, I "had a little bit to do with it." Literally a little bit. But it was his project. Not mine.

Reply to
Doug Miller

Sorry if I was confusing. Let me restate.

I come from a tradition that teaches good works are good for their own sake, not as an entrance fee to the hereafter and that was the message I was trying to convey. My tradition teaches that dwelling on the hereafter takes time and effort away from these good works and is, therefore, discouraged.

On the other hand, if someone's faith holds that one earns entrance in the world to come by doing good deeds, that's okay with me - the good gets done and I'm not too anal about the motivation.

On the other, other, hand, there is at least one religion that provides entrance to paradise is achieved principally by expanding the reach of the religion. If this reach is achieved by forcibly imposing the doctrine or killing apostates, infidels, and non-believers, that earns the actor a ticket in first class. And maybe even virgins.

Point is, if one's motivation is driven solely by a desire to enter a better place, the worldly results of that desire can be quite wicked.

Reply to
HeyBub

Well, what I meant was the creation of the outstanding young man. Get it now? ROFL

TDD

Reply to
The Daring Dufas

"HeyBub" wrote in news:QPednURixsJtsfjXnZ2dnUVZ snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.com:

I am more of an agnostic, but still believe in the performance of good works (or whatever name you'd give it) as an end in itself. Even helping the ltlle old lady across the street she wants to cross is a good deed, although there are and should be "bigger" things to strive for. The abuse of virgins is just that - abuse. Even the thought should be abhorrent, unless the virgin really wants to shed the appellation.

Reply to
Han

I do. Sorry I misunderstood your meaning.

Reply to
Doug Miller

Oh. Sorry. My grammer chequer didn't catch it.

Reply to
HeyBub

Hmm. "I consider myself a monothiest of the Hebrew persuasion." Sir Issac Newton.

And it's not the religion that's insane, it's some of the people who practice it.

'Course all this was settled in the 13th Century by Thomas Aquinas ("Summa Theologica" for the Christians), Maimonides ("Guide for the Perplexed" for the Jews), and Abu al-Walid Muhammad Ibn Rushid ("The Great Commentary" for the Muslims).

You really should keep up.

Reply to
HeyBub

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Reply to
RonB

mber

100 posts and well deserved. Not many make rank of Eagle and those who do deserve congratulations.

Congratulations!!!

RonB

Reply to
RonB

Chuck wrote in news:h48avi$7kg$ snipped-for-privacy@news.eternal-september.org:

Don't ask don't tell?

Reply to
Elrond Hubbard

on 7/19/2009 8:14 AM (ET) Doug Miller wrote the following:

There are three things that should never be discussed in public. Religion, politics, and the second amendment. :-)

Reply to
willshak

Smitty Two wrote: >> I just watched "Religulous." We non-believers see all religions as >> absolutely, completely insane. 93 % of scientists are in that camp.

No it's not "fine". I'm a non-believer and I don't see "all religions as absolutely, completely insane". At the very, very least, most religions are attempting to lead people in a moral direction. Nothing insane about that is there?

Personally, as a non-believer, I'm sick of the little weasel scum bags thinking they are speaking for ME. They are not, and their are plenty of non-believers that are not so insecure that they feel any need to attack believers.

Your son did a great job, and your wife too. I'm certain his achievement of Eagle scout status will benefit him throughout life, as it has so many before him.

Reply to
Jack Stein

a I have no problems with sponsoring organization pushing religion if it is a religious organization.

Reply to
Kurt Ullman

I was an assistant scoutmaster in a troop sponsored by a church. I took all of the leadership training available.

In seven years, I never heard a boy say the was Christian or agnostic. I never heard it in the training either.

The church never pushed it's doctrine.

It seems to me that a lot of people here without any experience with the scouts are talking about things they know nothing about.

Scouting is about citizenship, preparedness, and helping others, just basic good stewardship.

Reply to
Lowell Holmes

That's okay, too. Just if one goes to a religious sponsored group, they shouldn't act surprised and upset if it comes up.

On Usenet. Impossible. (g).

Reply to
Kurt Ullman

Kurt, I really was not responding to you. Some of the other posts are pretty incredible. I had resisted posting before.

The kids went to have fun. We canoed in white water, rock climbed, back pack camped and so on. I don't understand why a bunch of adults don't understand that.

I wonder how many of us could survive Philmont? :-)

At one time, I bled Boy Scout Khaki.

Reply to
Lowell Holmes

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