The latest issue of Fine Woodworking had a good evaluation article called "CAD on a budget". It reviewed CAD packages for under $100. Based on the reviews I decided to get a copy of Design CAD 3D Max. Boy was I chagrined to find they have DOUBLED the price of the software. Its now $199. It seems more than slightly coincidental that the price jumped so much right after a good review in a magazine. I think that practice stinks and I'll pass on the purchase.
Bob
I stand corrected on my post and I am sorry for misinformation. The web page for DesignCad has a BUY NOW link that takes you directly to a page with price listed at $199. However, this is for bundle package with several products. This is their so-called Platinum bundle and its very misleading. There is a fine print link at the bottom of the page that says "No thanks, proceed with original order" where I find out the CAD package alone is available for $89.95.
Bob
Seems a strange business practice.
You normally get what you pay for. :-) Design Cad has been around for quite some time. IINM, it was once called Prodesign, the first cad package I taught myself to use.
Mark & Juanita wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
Add on sales are a strange business practice? All that happened is he said I'd like to purchase product X and they said, in essence, "would you like to buy the super deluxe bundle which includes product X and well as products Y,Z and Q? " No, well thank you for your purchase of product X then. Every retailer on the planet has done this in some form or another.
Maybe somebody should point out to them the legal ramafications of such 'bait and switch' advertising.
Not at all. However, in most cases, the add-on is very clearly marked and is a selectable option, not the default. I haven't verified the OP's claims vis a vis the cited web site; however, if you read his description, the add-on is the prominent display and the purchaser's initial intent is a small, hidden option.
What is strange is that the prominent display (according to the OP, I haven't checked this out myself) defaults to the add-on, and it is only through a small, fine-print option at that bottom of the page that the purchaser's initial desired purchase is selected.
This is what I referred to as a strange business practice -- what is likely to happen when a purchaser runs into a larger than expected cost is for the purchaser to clear the window and leave the site. I suspect the site designer is hoping the purchaser will simply click through and wind up spending more money than intended. Most sites that have add-ons clearly mark the add-ons as such and provide *them* as the option.
snipped-for-privacy@host122.r-bonomi.com (Robert Bonomi) wrote in news:f0f9e$4141cab2 $44a75e7a$ snipped-for-privacy@msgid.meganewsservers.com:
There aren't any. In order for it to be bait and switch they'd have to advertise something and not offer it for sale. They're offering something and it's available. They've just made the website confusing. It's not really all that unusual, take a look at some major software company sites when there is a free version available like for example Acrobat reader. The option for the free one is well hidden and only obvious after scanning the page containing the ad copy for the commercial version. While I agree that this is poor marketing, and probably results in lost sales.. It is not, by any definition, bait and switch.
On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 15:39:30 +0000, snipped-for-privacy@host122.r-bonomi.com (Robert Bonomi) calmly ranted:
Sorry, other Bob, but it's only $79.95 here.
It's called "upselling", but the way they do it is pushing the envelope. Amazon.com uses a similar method called "cross- selling". When you add an item to your basket, they take you to a page full of similar goodies in the hope that you add some to your basket before returning to shop or check out.
It's legal. The way it's handled just isn't very tasteful. At the top, it says "Upgrade Your Order". The bottom text line is "No thanks, proceed to checkout with the original order.
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Well, yes and no. The FWW articles mentioned how good the tutorials were. Apparently they've seen broken them out and while the base program is under
100, the price about doubles if you want the tutorials. Do you need them? I've used other CAD packages so took a look at this >The latest issue of Fine Woodworking had a good evaluation articleGerryG wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
I have version 14. It came with a tutorial disk. Price - $80.00.
On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 18:23:15 GMT, GerryG calmly ranted:
Gerry, it's only $79.95 here and they still have (while they last) tutorial CDs.
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they only tested 48" clamps. the HF ones only go up to 36". however, they missed bessey tradesman, a serious omission. (hmm, maybe tradesmans only go to 40". shoulda altered the test. tradesman clamps are too good a contender to ignore.)
they also neglected to comment on a design element that to me is a major factor in the decision of what clamps to buy- that on all but what they called "parallel jaw" bar clamps (the cabinet master type) the gross and fine adjustments are at opposite ends of the clamp. to compound the aggravation, the sliding head on bar clamps like to rotate around the pipe out of alignment with the screw head. (can you tell I'm not a big fan of pipe clamps?)
Bridger
This was maybe a month ago, and suspect I only checked at the IMSI site for their prices, and they don't offer that. Don't have the FWW handy, but seem to recall they mentioned multiple CDs, and my impression is that only the Introduction CD comes with that Yahoo store offer.
If anybody has this, I'd be interested in how far that one training CD takes you.
Guess I should have known better than to just check the manufacturer for a price:-)
GerryG
Clicking the "all to cart" button takes you to a page reading "bonus special offer". To get past that page, you have to click either "yes, change my order" or "no thanks, proceed to checkout with my original order". Seems pretty clear to me, however, one might be confused if he had not read the options and tried to actually place the order.
Designcad was recently bought by IMSI. It's very likely that they sell the tutorials separately as that is what they do with their top of the line cad program, Turbocad. For 2D only work, I think probably the best deal going is Intellicad. It is an AutoCAD clone and as such, is a bit more difficult to learn than some programs but there are two distinct upsides to it. Since it is so AutoCAD like, tutorials meant for AutoCAD will get you where you want to go. The price is also great at less than $60.00 through CMS for the standard version.
What is an HF clamp? Can you provide a URL?
While I'm here, anybody like the Bessey Supergrip? Seems expensive but very useful.
Bessey's "Jig and Fixture clamp" and their "Legendary sliding arm clamp" under the industrial and welding clamps section seem useful to woodworkers, too.
What say y'all?
Hi - I figured I should respond to this post - I might have a little intimate knowledge of the subject.
I'll give you a little back ground here - The article was actually written in January and February of '04. At the time, the software reviewed was the latest version, and the prices were all correct. Between the time I reviewed the software, and the article was actually printed, DesignCAD was fully purchased by IMSI software, and a newer version of designCAD was released: Version 15. Apparently Version 15 can still be purchased for $99, but only comes with 1 training CD.
In all honesty, I don't believe that DesignCAD or IMSI knew how I evaluated either of their software products until the Magazine hit the News Stands - Never the Less, I wish they still kept the pricing the same.
I'm not Familiar at all with Version 15 of their software, but what I can say is if Version 15 is anything like 14, then it's still a decent buy -
Hope this answers some questions - Thanks for reading!
Gregory Paolini - Roycroft Renaissance Artisan Handcrafted Custom Furniture & Cabinetry
For what its worth - Half of my Pipe Clamps are Pony's, the other half are Harbor Freight. Pony's are nice, but I bought Just as many HF's for 1/3rd the price.
Besides - I grab my "K" Bodies anytime I need to do a critical glue up
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