Maybe so but the best coffee I ever had in my life was at the Cafe de la parroquia in Veracruz, Mexico. Their coffee was made with steam - 212 + heat of conversion - on an Italian machine dating from 1870.
The home made coffee I prefer is made on a French press by pouring boiling water over the grounds.
Right. Pour in the water, let it steep a moment or two, push the strainer down, pour into a room temperature cup. It would still be to hot for you and I if it were black but I add cold milk and that gets it OK. Used to drink coffee with just sugar but after I got hooked on lecheros - strong coffee and hot milk - in Mexico I started making coffee about double strength and adding milk.
...and like their customers want it.
Go figure, a drive-thru puts lids on served liquids. Who wudda thunk!
...and not a lot cheaper than places far better. We do go to McDs sometimes for breakfast when we're traveling, though.
My wife mentioned that Starbucks would serve it hot but AFAIK, they're the only one that will. I can't stand Starbucks coffee, though.
No, I sure don't, however I don't see it being the company's business to protect dolts from themselves. It's an impossible task.
Which is where is *should* be.
I've never had more than 1st degree burns from any drinks. Of course, I don't put cups between my legs, sitting in a car, either. they invented these neat things called "cup holders". ;-)
Good. That's the way I like it.
700 people out of billions and billions served. Your point? How many people choked on the burgers or drown in the bathroom?I agree. They shouldn't be serving coffee to infants. That *is* dumb.
People want to take it with them. Hence the "drive thru". They don't want it cold when they drink it.
McDs admitted that people are stupid. So?
They didn't tell people the obvious. So?
They admitted that they served what their customers demanded.
Life is dangerous and it never ends well. Get used to it.
I haven't had a hot cup of coffee at DDs for more than a decade. Rarely is it any more than warm.
A neighbor from Brazil makes extra strong, freshly ground coffee and uses this:
I've had plenty of coffee in a couple of trips around the globe and nothing compares.
On Fri, 16 May 2014 14:46:25 -0400, "dadiOH"
I don't drink coffee, but I've seen the advertisements for Tim Horton's coffee. I visit one of their stores for lunch three times a week. Tim Horton's guarantees a new pot of coffee every twenty minutes if it isn't finished first. Just for the hell of it, I watched during the lunchtime rush as a new pot of coffee got emptied within six minutes. I don't know how fast a pot would cool, but I'm reasonably sure it would still be pretty damned hot that entire six minutes. ~ enough so to burn skin on contact.
I confess I've come into work and microwaved the coffee that was leftover from yesterday! ;)
:)
I suppose powdered milk could be handy but I'm happy with fresh. I don't know about Venezuela but fresh milk is not often - even ever - available in some places. In Mexico, I don't ever recall seeing it, just one liter cartons of ultrapasturized milk; that too was handy because even though we had a refrigerator, many people did not and the ultrapastureized does not need refigeration until opened and one liter is easy to use up quickly.
Oh brother ...
Your new coffee machine brews at between 187 and 192 degrees, depending on which setting you chose.
IMHO this conversation is starting to sound like the law suite brought against Ryobi by the guy that cut his finger off because he did not use the equipment properly.
Is placing a closed container, containing a known hot product, between your legs to secure it while opening it not an accident waiting to happen?
It is mentioned that in a 10 year period that 700 people have been burned by spilling coffee in genital area, perineum, inner thighs, and buttocks. I don't recall seeing any mention of body parts being burned when the coffee was applied to the intended body parts. ;~)
One buys "hot" coffee vs. iced coffee because it is hot beverage. If you buy a hot product you should take care not to pour it all over your self. Pizza is classically served HOT. You pull out a piece and place it right into your mouth and scald the inside of your mouth, is the establishment at fault?
IMHO regardless of temperature, different parts of your body are going to burn more easily, at lower temperatures that others. I can easily put something much hotter in my mouth than I can stand to hold on to. Ones mouth and lips are accustomed to having hot things placed into it/them.
Do you think that if the coffee that is hot, but you can sip it, gets thrown on your hand that you will not burn?
One also has to wonder that if the fabric melted what kept the plastic cup from melting.. ;~)
Now having said that if the cup of coffee was stilling boiling when the lady was attempting to open the cup between her legs I could see that being a problem with the temperature being served but according to the article 130 degrees is hot enough to cause a burn. I'm thinking that one would not accept a cup of coffee that is served at that low temperature.
Define undrinkably hot. Would you serve a drink to a five year old at the same temperature that you might drink it?
Do you often place hot liquids served in squishy styrofoam cup between your legs to open them?
This is not directed at you. I avoid both establishment too, not because of the temperature of their products but because the products them selves long term are more harmful than any thing else.
Most wood working tool manufacturers turned down the opportunity to sell a safer saw and continue to sell saws that are more dangerous to operate than other brands. Do they not give a rat's ass about our safety should we attempt to use them in an unsafe manner? ;~)
There seems to be a double standard going on. Some of us think that the temperature of hot coffee should be better regulated and that the government getting involved to prosecute the provider is OK.
So does that mean that we don't want the government to do something to protect us to begin with, SawStop, and that we would rather sue later if we are harmed doing something that we should not have been doing in the first place, opening hot coffee between our legs?
I would rather take care of myself rather than some bureaucrat in Washington tell me how to live. Unless the widget was being used as designed and didn't malfunction (particularly in a previously known manner), I should be on my own, thank you.
Agreed, but I was making the comparison to many here thinking that MD should be punished for those not wanting to take responsibility for opening the coffee in an unsafe manner.
Leon wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@giganews.com:
She was trying to add cream & sugar.
For the real story:
Do note: "Stella Liebeck's lawsuit was turned into a punch-line as many news outlets overlooked the critical facts of the case including the nearly
700 other complaints that McDonalds had received about their hot coffee."And: "Fact: Stella suffered third-degree burns (the most serious kind of burns) over her lap, which included large portions of her inner thighs and other sensitive areas. She was hospitalized for 8 days and endured several very painful procedures to clean her wounds. She required skin grafts and suffered serious and permanent scarring."
As to the amount: "They initially decided to order the restaurant chain to pay her $160,000 in medical expenses and compensatory damages, as well as an additional $2.7million in punitive damages.
The judge was the one to reduce that amount down to $640,000 before the final payout was settled out of court.
What wasn't commonly reported was the way in which the jury came up with the $2.7million figure.
At the time, McDonalds earned roughly $1.33million per day on coffee sales alone, so the jury felt it was appropriate for them to pay the equivalent of two day's earnings."
Do note that the final settlement was undisclosed but far less than $1M
??
Bzzzztt .... This was a _civil_ lawsuit.
No "government involvement" at all, and none remotely discussed, anticipated or ever even suggested.
Once again, what any of us, including our resident trolls, consider is a proper "serving temperature for coffee is totally irrelevant to the reality of the situation.
When you lose a _civil_ lawsuit in front of a jury of your peers and based on presented facts of questionable business practices, you change those questionable business practices.
As has happened countless times to protect consumers, our CIVIL legal system punished a questionable, and provably injurious, business practice, which is exactly what it was designed to do.
End of story...
Actually she was removing the lid.
from your link,
After their order was completed, her grandson pulled the car forward out of the drive-through lane and stopped again to allow Stella to add cream and sugar to her coffee. Stella placed the coffee between her knees so she could use both hands to open the lid and add her sugar. While removing the lid the cup tipped over and poured the entire cup of 190 degree coffee all over her sweatpants, which absorbed the hot liquid and held it against her skin.
Actually the details of these 700 complaints were covered in a more complete article where many of those 700 complaints mentioned burns that were received to parts of the body that coffee is not intended to be administered.
From 1982 to 1992, McDonald's coffee burned more than 700 people, many receiving severe burns to the genital area, perineum, inner thighs, and buttocks;
This happens pretty often when you pour scalding liquids on yourself.
Try pouring a cup of scalding hot water from you kitchen sink, which is approximately 35% cooler than a normal cup of coffee onto your crotch.
I know, tomato, tomaato.... The government was still involved in allowing the proceedings.
Sorry, I should have said that the government run court room oversaw the proceedings brought to it and a government appointed judge guided those proceedings according to law.
Was the court room a private building or a public government building? Was the judge that overruled some of the damages and over saw the proceedings according to law hired by the attorneys or appointed by a government entity?
I guess the point I am trying to make here is that many sided with the lady that did not insure against spilling coffee on herself and most of those have admitted that they don't care for McDonald's and or McDonald's doesn't give a rat's ass about the consumers safety.
On a similar point a lot of people like Ryobi, many here promote their good experiences with the product. I used to have a great AP-10 Ryobi planer. When the flooring guy cut his digit off because he was not careful, the fact that he won the suite against Ryobi for his own carelessness was about the most ridiculous thing any of us had heard of.
Now if the same guy had overridden the safety stop and done the same with the SawStop i think many here may have sided with the idiot because of the past tactics used by SawStop to bring their product to market.
Yes you do, But where do you draw the line? Should restraints risk loosing 99.990% of their customers to protect against the possibility of the other .001% harming themselves?
If I burned my self by spilling coffee made in my correctly operating coffee maker, sued the manufacturer, and won, would you expect for that manufacturer to recall your coffee maker and readjust it so that it no longer heated water hotter than a 130 degrees, which will cause 3rd degree burns, instead of the 187~192 degrees that it operates at now?
Don't know how accurate that is because strangely enough, and according to this supposedly highly accurate digital medical thermometer used in chemotherapy applications, the coffee had a range of 138.4 to 128.8F temperature as it hits the cup:
The coffee grounds, immediately after brewing, read 142F.
Focused on the stream of water, on the "Hot Water" setting, held a steady 164.8F:
Cool thermometer ... I have requisitioned it from the "cold cap" box of goodies we give out to chemo patients to keep them from losing their hair. There is a very narrow range they must achieve to keep their scalp from frost bite, so these things are extremely accurate.
Also been known to use it to test AC vents for the proper temperature.
Or the civil lawsuits against the car manufacturers regarding seat belts and rear end collisions; or tire manufacturers, or ... ad infinitum.
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