Counter top

[Greg O]

I need to replace a counter top, on the cheap, but I want it to last! I will be making my own, with some sort of lamiate. My question is the substrate. The last counter was made from laminate and particle board substrate and the partical board got wet and of course, expanded. I am wondering what material would be best for substrate, something that could hold up to the ocasional saoking. I was thinging MDO plywood, the stuff they make road signs out of, second chice would be good old exterior grade plywood. someone recommended green treated, but it is in a food prep area so that makes it a bad choice.

[Ed Pawlowski]

"Greg O" wrote

That would be my choice.

Agree, I'd not use it.

[Larry C]

Not sure where you are going to get your laminate.

I did mine a few years ago and found a Wilson Art distribution center in the Boston area. They sold to the public and the prices and selection blew away the big retail guys. They even sold the bevel edge for the front which made it look real professional.

Just a thought

Larry C

[Robatoy]

Heeeey.. I know something about countertops.

laminate jobs are not for the amateur, really. By the time you select your substrate and buy your glue, trim-bits and so on, is it really worth doing? Hire a pro. Spend a few dollars and make sure they seal all the exposed edges, like inside sink holes and tap holes and all along the entire back. To get a good seam, if there's going to be one, is not that easily done. I would investigate solid surface, acrylic, non-DuPont Corian (too expensive in most cases) like Meganite, LG and HiMacs. Nothing to worry about substrates, you get to undermount your sink and the surface is non-staining and can be refinished in case of damage or scratches. There are guys around who will charge a fair dollar for solid surface work. Stay away from the snooty high-end guys.

[dadiOH]

Decent, smooth plywood works fine. HD/Lowes generally has D-4 birch; way over priced for D-4 but useable. Virola works too.

[Pat Barber]

There is such a thing as cabinet grade particle board.

It's not sold in lumber companies or home centers. It doesn't die with water contact and should be covered with laminate anyway.

Plywood is a bad idea because of warping.

I would look around for either solid surface or factory made counter tops with rolled edges and back splash.

Be aware that a counter with a turn is difficult to accomplish with typical home owner tools.

Long runs that require joining edges also requires special router tools to do a professional job.

A cheap counter t> I need to replace a counter top, on the cheap, but I want it to last! I

[nailshooter41]

Sometimes, there are certain tasks best left to the expertise of others.

Back 35 years ago, we used to do it out of necessity. I still have the laminate trimmers, the bits, guides, etc. from when I stopped doing it 20 years ago. It isn't brain surgery, but the learning curve can be *quite* expensive.

The results from a first time lamination project are rarely acceptable. And I don't want anything in my house that I have to say "well, that was the first time I had ever tried that, but I saved some money and learned a lot along the way".

I would think that at this time you could find someone that would be happy to do a job that for a fair price. A guy that does this all day long can turn out a kitchen in post form laminate in a few hours from start to finish, depending on the complexity.

Then they haul off the old tops. You have a , the sink hole is in the right place, the edges are all finished correctly, you have a happy spouse, and you are finished in one day. All you have to do is hook the plumbing back up.

Call the laminate suppliers and the solid surface guys in your area and ask for a recommended installer.

Robert

[Larry C]

The last two posters bring up a good point. How long is the job to last? What I mean is, I did mine because we were going to redo the whole kitchen and get some solid counter tops (insert recession here). So the job was to last just a couple of years and I went on the cheap about 2 weeks before the family holiday party - 4 years ago.

Get a few prices first.

Larry C

[Robatoy]

nevamar all have strongly suggested not to use laminated woods (Plywoods) as the laminate itself will delaminate the first layer of ply over time.... and I have seen that happen with a few backsplashes I crafted for a job.

[Greg O]

Heeeey.. I know something about countertops.

laminate jobs are not for the amateur, really. By the time you select your substrate and buy your glue, trim-bits and so on, is it really worth doing? Hire a pro.

Ummm, no thanks, I am doing it myself! This is my forth venture into laminate in as many years. The stuff don't scare me at all, and I refuse to pay someone 3 times the price of what I can do it for myself. The top I am looking at replacing is "L" shaped, 92x42 inches across the backsplash., one 4x8 sheet of substrate, one 4x8 sheet of Formica, the tools I have. One afternoon in the shop watching NASCAR and a couple beers should do it. The whole she-bang should be less than $150. I got one qoute already for $600! Greg

[Greg O]

I got prices, no way! Too high! Like I said in my other post I have done this before, just looking for recommendations for substrate. It ain't rocket science! As far as hauling of the old tops, we have a huge roll off dumpster at work that just gobbles this stuff up! I know about the quick kitchen fix, this is the second redo in 15 years. No counter top the first time! I refuse to spend any more money on it than necessary because it will get all torn out sooner than later! I will not put good, high priced tops on these old cabinets as the whole works needs to go away. When we finally do a gut job on the kitchen then I will look into solid surface, maybe granite. Greg

[Greg O]

Solid surface is out because of the cost.

Factory made is out because I don't want the seam in the coner of the "L".

That leaves me with custom, which I can do myself.

I have the tools! Greg

[Greg O]

Reading the posts about this got to me a bit! I thought this was a DIY group to some extent! Seems most of the posts want me to hire a pro, or order ready made! Maybe we all should put our tools away and just buy factory made, or let the pros do the work! I have the tools, I have the ability, I just wanted a recommendation for substrate, not warnings about the degree of difficulty.

"confused!"

[Robatoy]

You asked for advice without detailed information. You got that. Now go learn some manners.

[Scott Lurndal]

Many of the posters who responded "hire a pro" _are_ countertop fabricators and installers. They have a vested interest, and a bit of experience.

scott

[Lew Hodgett]

--------------------------------------- You have the tools as well as an attitude. Take a hike.

Lew

[Max]

I have to vote (again) for tile. It's easy to install, inexpensive, (unless you use some exotic type) durable, and available in many colors or patterns. I installed mine over 3/4" (exterior glue) plywood. It is 24 years old and I'm replacing it only because I'm doing a whole cabinet replacement job. If you don't have a tile saw, you can rent one. Personally, I wouldn't even consider anything else that's available.

Max

[Greg O]

I figured that out! I see on other groups where the pros tell posters that what ever they want to do is to difficult, hire a pro! To me it kind of stinks a bit that they are trying to protect their job.

I suppose I came across as a smart ass, but geez, after most of the posts tell me it is way to hard, or expensive for a DIY'er, I get a little cranky! As far as I am concerned, setting laminate is neither hard, or expensive, at least not compared to hiring it out!

Like I said, maybe we should all put our tools away, as woodworking can be expensive, and difficult to do! Greg

[Robatoy]

With all that ability and knowledge, you couldn't figure out something as simple as what substrate to use?

[Lee Michaels]

"Greg O" wrote

You have obviously figured us all out. That is why we spend so much time bitching and whining with one another. Cause woodworking is just so...o...o...o...o...o...oo HARD.