Bowing hand saw cut

I have a couple slabs that I need to resaw and they are too wide for my band saw, so I have had to cut on each side to max depth on the TS with a thin kerf blade and am left with a 3" strip in the middle to cut by hand. The problem is the cut is bowing as it progresses, on the first one I ended up with a 1/16" bow in the middle. Similar thing happened on a wider slab but I really didn't think it'd be an issue over just 3". Technique problem or saw problem?
And I really hate Leon right about now.
-Kevin
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Are you thinking about my 16"er. LOL
I "used" to use a recip saw to take out the center. And of course, I allowed plenty of material for the planer to bring things flat again.
If you essentially have a 3+" kerf on the beginning and end to guide the hand saw, I would find it hard to blame technique.
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Yeah, and apparently I wouldn't even need to sand it after :P But I am waiting for Festool to come out with one ;)

Don't have one of those either. I went to look at what Delta is charging for the riser kit these days and nearly fell over. $130?? The Grizzly version of the same thing is $60 but they apparently aren't compatible. Add in new blades and not being able to use the new ones I have on hand, I'd rather put the away towards a better saw in the future than throw more money at this one.
It doesn't really matter what my final thickness ends up being, it's some crotch area cherry that is all either cracked or has voids, so it needs to be backed up with something regardless. The real problem is with the saw being bent through the cut it is REALLY hard to do it. I'm a wimp, but it shouldn't have taken an hour to get through the first one and my arm is going to fall off.

Well, the kerf is still quite a bit wider than the saw so it's not really doing anything until the saw is already being bent enough to hit it. I just don't know if something like the set of the teeth being off on one side or something could cause that.
-Kevin
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On 4/28/2009 11:34 AM snipped-for-privacy@YAHOO.COM spake thus:

You're complaining about a 1/16" error in a deep cut in [assuming] hardwood in a [assuming] long cut with a handsaw? (You're sawing the remaining material in the entire length of the ripped piece, right?)
If I were you I'd be congratulating myself on a job well done.
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I have it basically standing up on end, so I am going across the remaining 3" with the kerfs to guide me at the near and far ends. The problem isn't really the error but because the saw is being bent to get through the kerf it is taking a lot of effort to make the cut, it starts off easily enough and just gets progressively harder. I can make it a little easier sticking in a shim to open it up but not much better.
-Kevin
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snipped-for-privacy@YAHOO.COM wrote:

How much set do you have on the teeth? It might be that you need a little more for a cut that deep to keep the kerf wide enough to avoid binding.
FWIW, Tage Frid recommends using a frame saw for that particular cut, probably to avoid the problem you're seeing. If you want to take a shot at a frame saw, Highland Woodworking has blades for under 10 bucks and a couple of sites that show how to make the frame are http://swingleydev.com/woodworking/jigs.php and http://www.hyperkitten.com/woodworking/frame_saw.php3 . It's not all that big a project if you have a table saw and don't try to get artistic. Get the blade first though because you're going to want to make the frame to fit the blade you have.
Another option might be a ryoba-type pull saw (note, that's ryob_a_, a kind of handsaw, not ryob_i_ the maker of power tools) but if you're not used to a pull saw you may find it awkward until you get used to it.
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arehttp://swingleydev.com/woodworking/jigs.phpandhttp://www.hyperkitten.com/woodworking/frame_saw.php3 . It's not all that

Good suggestions. I suspect it's just dull. The band saw does the same thing with a dull blade, but I thought that was because of the way it's restrained. I don't see why the hand saw wouldn't just pull to one side rather than make a non-straight cut.
-Kevin
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On 4/28/2009 2:17 PM snipped-for-privacy@YAHOO.COM spake thus:
>

I see the problem. Have you tried waxing the saw?
Sounds like the saw's fault, not your technique. Your saw wants to pull to one side; might be time to get it resharpened and re-set.
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spake thus:

Just to make sure, you are sawing the short side, saw goes through the kerf on both sides, not starting in one kerf and hoping to meet the other when finished.
Also IIRC you mentioned thin kerf blade to start with, use a regular kerf blade this will decrease the chance of pinching the hand saw blade.
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spake thus:

I'd suggest waxing the blade and "laying it down in the kerf" as you cut so that more of the blade is in the table saw kerf. If you angle the board in the vice you don't have to angle yourself... also, flip the board around and cut from the opposite side as you run out of guiding handsaw kerf... much as you should when resawing entirely by hand. Shimming the stock is perfectly acceptable if you have a problem with the kerf closing up!
John
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In article <64e34e0e-e87b-45a5-bdca-8a51885e06e5

You've just nailed a bit of my suggestion.
Internal stresses in the wood are probably closing the kerf and pinching the saw.
If you haven't already, shim along the length of the cut you've taken with your table saw and then shim as you go behind the hand saw.
I would wonder if you aren't seeing a bit of torsion in the wood too.
I would also wonder if you aren't going to see the wood bend in a different direction when you go to resaw it.
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Well apparently the posts I made last night never showed up. Just to be clear, after the cut was done the other side of the board is still flat, and on the concave side if you put a straight edge across it at the edges where the TS cuts are they are still parallel, in between the two it's concave.
The band saw will do the same thing with a dull blade, or not enough tension, but I thought that was because of the geometry of how the blade is tensioned. I have no idea when that saw was last sharpened (if ever) but I figured if it wasn't dull when I started it was when I finished. At any rate I opened up Leonard Lee's book today and took a shot at sharpening it. I don't have a saw set so I just filed it, and now it's cutting twice as fast and doesn't seem to be bowing. Haven't got it cut through yet as my hand is still an interesting shade of red from yesterday. I guess I have no first hand experience of what a sharp saw ought to do, so I didn't realize how dull it was. I'm sure it's not as sharp as it could be either, I just took 5 strokes on each tooth and hoped for the best.
-Kevin
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wrote:

For some reason my posts from google aren't showing up, so we'll try this instead.
Just so we're clear, the board isn't warping. The other side is still flat and I can put a straight edge against it and at the edges where the TS cut is those are still parallel to each other, it's in between.
The band saw does the same thing with a dull blade, though I don't understand why a hand saw that isn't under tension would do the same thing I have no idea how long ago it's been sharpened and I figured if it wasn't dull when I started it probably was by the time I was done.
So I cracked open Leonard Lee's book and gave it a shot, I don't have a saw set so I just filed it as it was. What a difference! It cuts twice as fast now. I didn't complete a cut so I am not 100% sure, but it's not getting harder as the cut progresses so it looks like that solved it.
I just didn't have any first hand experience with what a sharp saw ought to do, so I didn't know how dull it was. And I am sure a better sharpening job could have been done, so I probably still don't know, but at least I know a little more. I just wish I knew it before my hand turned interesting shades of red.
-Kevin
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You still need to saw straight down inside the TS kerf. If the saw wanders unequally and wasn't guided by the kerf, the cut would have slowly twisted as you progressed down the cut. As it is, the saw just bends where it rubs against the "guide". To fix it, back up a few inches, and use short nibbling strokes to steer the cut back to the center and straight. This is no different from resawing entirely by hand. If the board is long enough, you will have learned to make a straight ripping cut when you're done. ;)
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On 4/29/2009 9:13 AM MikeWhy spake thus:

>

That reminds me of Bill Cosby's old "Noah" routine:
VOO-pah! VOO-pah! etc.
(other old farts like me may get this reference)
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I do NOT consider myself to be an old fart... however, I do remember when he started doing that routine. ;~) I also bought the "album" on CD a couple years ago so my boys could hear it! LOL
John
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On Apr 28, 2:34pm, snipped-for-privacy@YAHOO.COM wrote:

What sort of handsaw are you using? Do you maintain the angle of cut throughout the cut?
R
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