Are there any tools to help cope crown molding?

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Anyone seen any tools to help cope crown? Rockler has a plastic device to help keep a jig saw at right angle and still sit on something. Doesn't look like it would help much.....
Highland Hardware sells a coping foot that relaces the flat base of a jig saw with a rounded piece. Looks like it would work good but probably has a huge learning curve.
I'm only doing a single room and don't need a Copemaster or anything that will take the entrie room's worth of molding to practice on.
TIA
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Coping saw.

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A pencil, a coping saw, a utility knife, and a Dremel Moto Tool (or a few small files/rasps).
I assume you are trying to get a good fit on an inside corner?
For that, put one piece in "square cut" so that it fits flush against the wall. The second piece gets coped. Cut that piece at a 45 degree angle. Use the side of the pencil lead to mark the edge. Cope back along that line just a little more than 45 degrees, careful not to overshoot the line. Then, using a 1/2" diameter sanding drum on the Dremel, file away as much as needed. Make the places where the shape changes "perfect" with the knife.
Test your work, on the floor, against a scrap. When you've "got it," then climb the ladder and put it in place.
Remember, ONLY the VISIBLE intersection of the two pieces matters. The joint does NOT have to be good enough for gluing.
"Piece of cake." After all, it's "only a single room" so you only do this four times, typically.
Jim Stuyck
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Hold it right there!
If you lay crown molding *flat* on your table saw or radial arm saw, or stand it up *flat* against the fence on your chop saw, and then cut the end at 45 degrees, it ain't gonna be right.
The molding needs to be tilted to the same orientation that it will be in when installed, and *then* mitered at 45 degrees, for the cut line to be in the right place.
Except for that minor detail, you have everything else right.
Use the side of the pencil lead

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
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wrote:

I thought that would be "understood." ;-)
Actually, "chop saw" is yet another "tool." Or a miter box.
And as to "orientation," typically you put it into the chop saw upside down (the fence of the saw represents the wall, the table of the saw represents the ceiling, giving you two good surfaces to hold the molding against without wobble).
Jim Stuyck
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Jim Stuyck wrote:

<snip>
<snip>
Hey Jim, why the pencil? If you cut the board 45 (properly oriented for crown molding), then you already have your edge clearly defined for you by the beveled/mitered cut. At least, that's how I've always done it.
Curious, H
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<snip>
<snip>
Hey Jim, why the pencil? If you cut the board 45 (properly oriented for crown molding), then you already have your edge clearly defined for you by the beveled/mitered cut. At least, that's how I've always done it.
Curious, H
The pencil mark, along the edge, serves as a clear "mark" to which you cope the joint. Without the mark it's easy to lose track of the edge. The technique is DON'T lose the mark.
Jim Stuyck
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I have always used a pencil line on the sharp edge of the cut too. Found it makes it a lot easier to follow the edge line when using a coping saw Chuck
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On Sun, 06 Aug 2006 04:56:03 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@myplace.com wrote:

As some of the guys point out above, it needs to sit on the mitre saw in the same orientation that it will sit on the wall, except upside down. Even small deviations from the exact correct position will make the cut line incorrect. At that point you make a 45' inside cut and then cope the fine line between end and face grain.
Other tools- A Rasp or rotary grinder can be helpful. Always cut your cope with as high of an opposite angle as possible to remove the "back" of the cut. Hint- you might be surprised to find how much of the "back" you need to remove to get the moldings to fit snugly together.
It seems impossible until you get the nack. I cut copes as tight as a drum on big crown and can do so fairly quickly and smoothly.....but...it was not always this way..:). It took years to learn.
And remember, copes are far more immune to the small movements of most structures. Houses and buildings move around some and cutting compound mitres can result in the joints opening up much more than properly coped joints.
Good Luck, J
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All of the above assumes the walls meet at a perfect 90 degrees, which is rare. In my experience, the drywall finishers put lots of joint compound in the corners so they end up a bit obtuse from a perfect 90 degrees. A deviation of just a degree or two will show on a coped joint. Either measure the corner with an angle finder or cut a couple of small pieces 6" or so long to make a test miter joint for the corner and adjust the miter angle to make a good fit.
Regards, John.
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wrote:

Not correct - Coping will immunize against deviations far more than cutting compound angles.
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Joe Bemier wrote:

While it's true that a coped joint will hide deviations better than a mitered one, either will reveal errors as small as 1-2 degrees - which is why I wanted to point out to the OP that he should check the corner angles before coping. I did not advocate using miters for the final installation - only using mitered test pieces to measure the corner angle. It is precisely because of the miter's sensitivity to corner angle, and its relative ease of cutting, that I recommended making the test pieces in the first place.
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wrote:

Well, I don't find that.
Test it.
Cope out a 45 and lay them on a table in the position that they would sit on a wall. Swing either piece back and forth - either way and you will have to go more than a few degrees before you see a significant opening.
I make test pieces for some mitres, but not copes.
Cheers anyway, J
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snipped-for-privacy@myplace.com wrote:

http://www.collinstool.com/base.php?page=collins_coping_foot.htm
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What if a normal wall/ceiling wraps around a corner and joins to a cathedral ceiling wall and then goes to an inside corner of that cathedral ceiling wall?
Cathedral ceiling wall would have top of crown at its pitch and then when getting to the corner you have join to that pitch with a regular 90 degree except that your run is the pitch of the ceiling.
Does all that make sense? It's a breakfast nook with regular ceiling abutting a cathedral ceiling room. TomNie
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You've gone beyond -- far beyond -- the initial request which was for a first-timer to tackle what was basically a simple rectangle in one room.
I will say that, for what you describe, if the "math" gets too complex (turning one of the corners you describe takes more than just two pieces), consider a "pinch block." Visualize a rectangular block of wood in the corner, angled on the top to fit flush to the ceiling and wide enough on the vertical sides so that the crown can butt against it.
One piece of crown would dead end into the block with a square cut. The other piece requires a SIMPLE angle cut, not a compound miter.
Now make the rectangular block "fancy" if you wish.
Jim Stuyck
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Thanks, Jim,
I'd seen something like that done at a Homearama and was one of my options. Didn't know its "name".
TomNie

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wrote:

Tom - Probably cannot be done cleanly. Sound similar to running Crown down the rake of say a 12 pitch roof and then trying to join it with the level Crown that goes along the Fascia. The angle canot be split properly because the length of the Crown on the angle is longer than the length of the angle of the crown on the level.
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Joe, you're right - it's that simple.
Guess it explains the pinch block solution. Thanks guys.
TomNie

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Tom Nie wrote:

Hi Tom:
You can run crown molding around a corner like this, but you have to either use a plinth block (never herd it called a pinch block) as others have suggested, or do the following:
Run the crown down the side wall (the wall with a level top edge against the sloped cathedral ceiling) and butt it into the gable wall (the wall with the sloped top edge). The next piece of crown is coped into the first as though the ceiling were level. This piece is also cut with an outside miter in the vertical plane. The third piece is mitered into the second, running vertically, and mitered against the fourth and last piece, which runs along the gable wall - ceiling edge. The second and third pieces end up being triangular. This is hard to visualize without pictures, but I don't have any. Just imagine the crown running out from the side wall level along the gable end wall, then turning vertically up the gable end wall, then turning at the ceiling angle.
I have found that for steep ceilings (above 8/12 or so), the crown run along the side wall looks better if you place a small triangular piece of molding above the crown that can fit tightly against the ceiling and eliminate the gap where the top edge of the crown would meet the ceiling. For 12/12 ceilings, I use 3/4" cove molding with the cove against the ceiling. This makes a tiny soffit of sorts, that visually anchors the crown to the sloped ceiling surface and makes the preceding corner treatment work a little better.
Plinth blocks are much easier, but I thought you'd like an alternative.
Regards, John.
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