Any Suggestions....Metal Rulers

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Bruce Barnett wrote:

Definitely confused, because I never claimed that Stanley used the wrong term, I never claimed that "rule" was incorrect. In fact I suggest the references that you could use to find the acceptable term. I suggest you go back in the comment tree to Amused's 1/31 comment showing that different manufacturers use different names.
This is by far too tedious and you are too confused to continue.
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Sigh.. Only Snap-on and DickBlick were inconsistent.
Stanley, Starrett, Lufkin and General all use "rule" consistently, and I pointed this out. I own products by these manufacturers, and as I said, I consider them authorities on the subject.
I don't hear people bragging about the Snap-on, DickBlick or Rhino ruler they own, and I don't consider them authorities.
I said:

And you relied:

So apparently I'm an idiot for considering Stanley et al to be authority.
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wrote:

Consider,
"Precise rules are necessary for precision work."
"Precise rulers are necessary for precision work."
Does precision in language trump precision in communication? I would submit that in this particular case (admittedly a contrived example), a rigid adherence to a specialized definition, could well create confusion in a non-specialized audience.
If you feel the need, you may express your opinion at length and I would stipulate that whatever opinion you express would have it's passionate defenders, only noting that entirely opposite opinions would be able to muster supporters, too.
BTW, the only reason I've bothered with all the research is that I happen to believe that precision in language is important, as long as a rigid adherence to the rules is not used as a bludgeon to stop all language development.
So, after some research, I am quite prepared to accept that "rules" is probably preferred, in some arenas, but would argue that "rulers" is accepted in others. (It's a machinist's rule, it's a graphic artist's ruler)
I remain unconvinced that in the general USENET format, (specifically rec.woodworking) "rule" is superior to "ruler". I am willing to accept that in another NG, rec.machinist (if there is such a group) "ruler" might be totally unacceptable.
However, a question does emerge.
"Why would "rulers" be considered correct in schools, (a primary training arena for language), but incorrect in all other applications?"
James...
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I was taught that a rule is for measuring with and a ruler is for drawing lines with. Granted that was 50-odd years ago, but I see no reason to change.
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sondar wrote:

May as well pitch in my $.02.
According to my drafting class (about 10 years back), you measure with a scale and draw lines with a straightedge.
Chris
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Pencil works better.
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NEVER use a scale to draw a line. ( I have had my knuckles rapped)
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Amused wrote: ((snipped))

I started to make a list of answers to your last question but it became too surreal.
For example, teachers are the rulers in school so call the stick of wood a ruler and use it to enforce the rules.
Won't bother to add more.
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Boy oh, boy.
In some academic circles, that care about that kind of thing, it seems that there is a developing theory that language mutation/migration/development/whatever is accomplished by ... females. Females traditionally, and still, are the primary source of language learning, and in addition, females are still the primary teachers in the lower school grades when most of the language is learned.
Can you see it coming, now?
Most non-technical females probably wouldn't know about a rule/ruler specialized definition, and it wouldn't be until much later in the educational process, when highly trained technical males assume control of the training, maybe even in a post-secondary training, when the distinction would be made. For everyone not in those particular disciplines, there is every likelihood that they would have never be exposed to proper definitions. That would also provide one possible explanation why, in some of the "softer" disciplines, where precision is not so emphasized, that the distinction is not as recognized as in some other disciplines.
BTW, this particular theory is mine, alone, developed from an afternoon reading various language development sites. I wouldn't want to share it in any serious psychological newsgroup for fear of inducing catatonic howls of laughter.
Well, it's a working theory until a better one comes along.
Disconnect... I've been reading a ShopNotes article on using electrolysis to clean rusty steel tools. I have all the necessary equipment, except "washing soda", (NOT detergent!) I have no idea what that is, nor does SWMBO. Tomorrow, I will visit the local store and see if anyone THERE knows what it is.
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Washing soda, aka sodium carbonate. Close relation to baking soda (sodium bicarbonate). A "GOOD" hardware store should have some, and the bloke behind the counter (unless he (or she) is a spotty youth) should know what it is.
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SNIP

in centimetres. Very few "real world" uses, with the exception of fabrics and possibly a few others.
All most all trades use millimetres and metres. The Cabinet trade uses Millimetres or "mils". eg, 2400 mil, Building uses metres eg 2.4
Regards John
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Who ever thought a strip of metal could be such a lightning rod?
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I received several useful suggestions, but stumbled on a solution, that is awesome.
Shop Notes had an article on using electrolysis to clean steel tools. Sounds crazy, I know, but I tried it this afternoon and it worked amazingly well.
Using a auto battery charger, you immerse the steel tool in a solution of water an sodium carbonate, (a water softener found in cheaper detergents) and BINGO. In an hour or so, the tool is covered in a black soot-like gunk. Rinse and scrub lightly with a scotch brite, and the tool LOOKS BRAND NEW. I've done two rules this afternoon, with tremendous success. The numbers pop out on the shiny *new* surface. (It will not "fill in pits" but they won't have any rust in them, either)
This morning, I "cleaned" an old Craftsman block plane. (You have to remove any wood or brass parts, BTW) Again, it took two hours but the results were most pleasing.
CAUTION: We're talking water and electricity here. If you do something stupid, it's gonna hurt!
This article is very long, but detailed. http://users.andara.com/~pspencer/nsaeta/electrolysis.html
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Amused wrote:

IIRC was the subject of "Erin Brockovich". Not such a good byproduct of when stainless steel and electolysis meet!
dave
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: > : >>Over the years, I have acquired several metal rulers, some of them, very : >>detailed. : >> : > : > : > I received several useful suggestions, but stumbled on a solution, that is : > awesome. : > : > Shop Notes had an article on using electrolysis to clean steel tools. : > Sounds crazy, I know, but I tried it this afternoon and it worked amazingly : > well. : > : > Using a auto battery charger, you immerse the steel tool in a solution of : > water an sodium carbonate, (a water softener found in cheaper detergents) : > and BINGO. In an hour or so, the tool is covered in a black soot-like gunk. : > Rinse and scrub lightly with a scotch brite, and the tool LOOKS BRAND NEW. : > I've done two rules this afternoon, with tremendous success. The numbers : > pop out on the shiny *new* surface. (It will not "fill in pits" but they : > won't have any rust in them, either) : > : > This morning, I "cleaned" an old Craftsman block plane. (You have to remove : > any wood or brass parts, BTW) Again, it took two hours but the results were : > most pleasing. : > : > CAUTION: We're talking water and electricity here. If you do something : > stupid, it's gonna hurt! : > : > This article is very long, but detailed. : > http://users.andara.com/~pspencer/nsaeta/electrolysis.html : > : > : I read some of that article. Hexavalent chromium was mentioned, which : IIRC was the subject of "Erin Brockovich". Not such a good byproduct of : when stainless steel and electolysis meet! : : dave
Yeah, that's what the article says. Your point is?
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Pop wrote:

Dave
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wrote:

Shame it's so ignorant - there are better guides around. The hexavalent chromium scare is flown again, and apparently you can clean aluminium if you're careful (you can't).
Good process, but a bad page on it.
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Shop Notes #72 is the one I used. I was just searching for a WEB page that explained the process, and that one came up first.
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: wrote: : : >This article is very long, but detailed. : >http://users.andara.com/~pspencer/nsaeta/electrolysis.html : : Shame it's so ignorant - there are better guides around. The hexavalent : chromium scare is flown again, and apparently you can clean aluminium if : you're careful (you can't). : : Good process, but a bad page on it.
Good destructive criticism, too; got anything along the lines of positive criticism? Or don't you know what that means?
Personally, I enjoyed the article and have found verification/confirmation plus more details very easy to find.
Pop
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wrote:

Electrolysis using a stainless steel electrode in a 12V tank is _not_ going to produce hexavalent chromium. Please cite any reputable reference that claims otherwise.
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