I suspect if you walked into Lee valley and started pointing out to the customers that Lee Valleys Stainless Steel Bucket $28.50CDN is only $9.88CDN down the street at Princess Auto you wouldn't get any free coffee either.
I'm not complaining mind you, just sorta pointing it out. That's one hell of a markup Robin.:)
I'm off to check the cupboard for tuna.
UA100
I'd prefer salmon, if you have it.
Keith ... you said it better than I possibly could ... and faster too!
Let me see ... Sams has those 10 pound cans of tuna ...whatcha think ... an even dozen?
Rick
It is clear that Lee Valley has decided to charge higher prices to Canadian consumers harder because the Canadian market is simply less competitive than the US market. I am a Canadian living in the US and longtime Lee Valley buyer/supporter. When the 2004/2005 catalog came out, I was struck by the very high spread between US and Canadian pricing. An example is the Canadian-made Veritas Low Angle Block Plane - $99 in the US $139 in Canada (Implied exchange rate of $1.404). In June 2004 the US dollar was $1.32 Canadian, 8% lower than the spread implied by the catalogue differentials. The Dollar hasn't closed at $1.40 since August 2003. Hard to imagine the catalogue pricing is based on some proprietary view of future exchange rate changes, but Lee Valley could hedge away currency risk in any case.
If you really want to see how hard Canadians are getting boned, check out Bosch appliances, or, Tegs tools prices on most things, but Fein tools in particular, for a cold douche. By the way, I don't believe in the concept of "fair" prices. Companies are in the game to maximize profits, if Canadians have fewer options, it follows that, in general (not General, btw) they will face higher pricing.
John
It may seem clear to you but it is not to me. Could be other reasons. Perhaps the cost of getting the goods to Canada is higher than getting them to the US shipping warehouse. I don't know if any tarriff or duty is involved. I do know we ship a lot of goods to CA at US prices and the customer is paying more in total than the same thing sold in the US by the time he pays duty.
I have enough to keep me busy running my own business so I'm not going to try to run Lee Valley and make policy for them also.
IF I had a complaint, it wasn't that shipping was slow. It was that I couldn't get instant gratification.
Shipping has so far always been as promised, and very reasonably priced.
Were I to order by telephone, and not by the web site, I likely COULD have gotten faster shipping methods. But I didn't, I don't, and I still think they, LV, do a great job.
Patriarch
"Rick" wrote in news:anggd.8765$ snipped-for-privacy@twister.southeast.rr.com:
Discovery Channel had a special on Midwest Pumpkin Chunking contests. Do you think one of those babies could be modified? ;-)
One example - Dewalt 15ga finish nailer; in the US sold as low as $159 USD ($195 CAD), $399 in Canada. I can see how shipping may add $10 - $15 extra cost, but why is Dewalt charging double?
Exactly. And when I suggested to Robin a bit of free shipping might help correct this unfair imbalance he basically said he needs the extra cash from Canadians to subsidize the lower price he gives to Americans. And this guy claims to be a Canadian!
LOL!!
I needed that :)
Rob
You're absolutely right.
Over the last twenty years we've seen a huge shift to this "global Walmart" approach. Everything mass retail is now cheaper than it was twenty years ago, even in dollar terms, not just in real terms. Tool-wise I used to have the best toolkit on the block when I was just starting out, now B&Q (our orange borg) are selling tools I only dreamed of back then, and the TV shows suggest you can't do a thing unless you own the latest colour of plastic sanding machine.
Everything now is made in the same handful of Chinese factories, works equally badly, breaks in no time and the only discriminator left is price. So we take a full-steam-ahead slam into a Thatcherite monopoly where the only retailers left are Walmart and McDonalds. "Competitive" pricing delivers low prices, but it also removes every retailer except the very highest up the size and economy scale.
But I don't want cheap tools, I want _good_ tools. I now have the ability to affordably buy more rubbish tools than I could previously imagine. So why am I buying so few of them ? Why does my Dad bring back a bagful of junk every time he goes shopping, and I don't even bother looking unless it's either 50 years old or was hand-made by elves somewhere and with a pricetag to match. I would _love_ to deal with someone who's makign the product I want to buy, and sticking a reasonable markup on it. I won't even look at the price tag ! I'll maybe buy fewer of them, or wait longer before I buy it, but I'm basically going to buy that grommet-flanger someday because I've already decided I need one, whatever the price, not just because its under $5 and her off the telly was using one.
Strangely one of the few companies left doing what you bemoan the lack of seems to be Lee Valley. I agree with what you claim to be in favour of ! So why are you then griping and applauding Princess Auto, when they indulge in the sort of barrel-scraping I abhor ?
LV aren't making Holteys. They aren't shifting a million Eeezy-Set "Handyman" models every week. They're developing and manufacturing a tool (like their bench planes) that steals every good idea out there, then manufactures it to the highest standard that a bench woodworker can notice. And then the pricetag is still better than all the other companies that are even vaguely comparable.
Mainly they've gone bust. The mass-market just isn't buying on that basis. Record are gone. Clifton make their real money from megabuck tools for aerospace. Stanley has been junk for years.
I was making a point. Princess Auto is just one of the companies that buy the same third party stuff Lee Valley does but sells it at a much lower price.
I'm not disputing that Lee Valley has a line of superior tools of their own. Unfortunately I'm a power tool fanatic, hand tools are not for me.
I have dozens of tools, kitchen, and garden items from Lee Valley. They are my #1 Christmas gift supplier, have been for years. All my saw blades, bandsaw blades, sanding supplies, all come from Lee Valley. I have bought out the gift item store. From 5 strobe flashlights (very popular with teens) to 4 kitchen Cleavers, and three Lee Valley knife sets. My last two wedding gifts came from Lee Valley and the recipients are now big Lee Valley fans themselves. If it's stainless and for the kitchen I've bought it from Lee Valley. I never compared price. I never shopped around.
I just got tired of seeing Americans pay less than me in EVERY succeeding Lee Valley catalog. From a Canadian company! I'm not surprised to see all the Americans in this group support Robin. We Canadians get hosed, so they can get a deal.
True, we still have a few who service the construction trade in my area.
"mp" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@corp.supernews.com:
Subsidized health care? Technical support lines in French Canadian? Local content regulation?
Doing business across ANY border is a puzzle. This is one reason that NAFTA was proposed, and, in some form, instituted. Notice just how easily that project went together.
Notice how almost all threads devolve to politics?
Patriarch
More like because it's likely imported from the US into Canada but not made in the US, a duty is charged by Canada.
Robert,
Pricing based on cost is fundamentally flawed. (I'm making some assumptions on what you mean when you say "fair markup" - that the price is somehow algorithmically related to only the cost. If I'm wrong, I'm sure you'll let me know...)
What if a product was of a certain utility but cost much more to produce than the value the product provided? Would you charge the usual markup over the high production cost? Nobody would buy it.
What if a product provided immense utility, time or labor savings, etc., and you could only charge the standard markup over cost? This would be a major disincentive for inventing anything new and better; why would you spend all that R&D money? Your benefit for your innovation would be limited to your standard markup (but you'd probably get everyone buying your thing instead of the other).
If you can > There was a day when companies priced their products on a fair markup.
Quit whining- If you want compensation for your ummm... severe? gouging, take a look at how much less you pay for prescription drugs. Or go buy your stuff from one of the other suppliers.
I'll stop you there. I don't expect Lee Valley to return to that type of pricing. It not realistic in today's competitive marketplace. I was just annoyed when I made that statement. But the point I made about competitive pricing eating thousands of tons of trees in order to feed the marketplace almost daily PHONEY sales flyers in our newspapers and mailboxes was valid.
My annoyance with Lee Valley rests with every year seeing Americans paying less for the same product I buy. Many of those MADE IN CANADA! Robin has admitted that because the competitive marketplace in the US demands it he must give his American customers a better deal.
Well I don't have to like it and will continue to say so.
Sorry, my original 'whining' post was ON topic for this news group by virtue of Robin Lee's participation here. Now that this has become a flame war rather than a rational discussion of the facts, every post is on topic. Even your lame assed post.
No, it's what I was told on the phone by the PA dude.
I have two of the Lee Valley clamps, I've ordered 4 of the Princess auto clamps today. I'll let you know how they compare
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