Ah, the irony or Zen of Norm

Ok,
Was watching an old Norm show on DIY and it was the TS jig show where he talks about his old panel cutter and how he would like to update it. Well, if we want one like his new one, he will show us how to make it. Only problem is that he uses his OLD panel cutter to cut the panel for the new one! If you DON'T have his old panel cutter, and hadn't figured out how to cut a panel for the jig, you'd be scratching your head and saying: Huh?
Oh, the man is deep very deep!
MJ Wallace
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

Lay a board with a straight edge on the panel and clamp it in place. Then use a circular saw to cut it.     mahalo,     jo4hn
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wrote:

Kinda not the point. The point is that Norm uses a panel cutter to show you how to make a panel cutter.
todd
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Todd - You're thinking too hard. Give it up man!
RonB
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wrote:

Hmm. I think he knows HOW to do it - the panel cutter is not really needed. The point is the irony of using the OLD panel cutter to make the NEW panel cutter.
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wrote:

Kind of like needing a shop to build a shop, or needing a workbench to build a workbench... Ever wonder how the first tools were made? ;~)
John
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wrote:

snip
Roy Underhill spoke to that when he built the fold-up work bench. I built that bench and used it for a number of years. One of my sons has it now.
I seem to remember that you were at Williamsburg. If that's correct, I'm curious if you use the English pig sticker mortise chisel. Are the Ray Iles mortise chisels a form of the pig sticker?
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wrote:

Yes, I was a Williamsburg... Regarding mortise chisels, the Ray Iles (such as those shown on http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com ) are of a pattern that they could be called a pig sticker. I've seen several variants referred to as a "pig sticker" and personally am not sure that there is a "perfect model pig sticker." The L-N mortise chisels have parallel sides vs. the trapezoidal shape of the Iles and I've seen that style too referred to as a pig sticker. Perhaps one of the antique tool collectors here may add historical context to the term for us.
I fondly recall creating things out of nothing at Williamsburg... the process of making a screw plate for machine screws, for example, involved making the original screw with files, turning it into a tap, threading the screw plate blank and then turning the screw plate blank into a tool by filing in slots and hardening/tempering the tool. The evolution of hammers is another interesting thing: a rock .... to a hammer.
John
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I have to wonder though, how many people will build the old panel cutter just so they can make the cuts for the new panel cutter.
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Wed, Jul 11, 2007, 11:43pm (EDT+5) d@p (DaveGordon) doth sayeth: Hmm. I think he knows HOW to do it - the panel cutter is not really needed. The point is the irony of using the OLD panel cutter to make the NEW panel cutter.
I'd say that's just bing practical. I'd call it irony if he "had" to have the old one to make the new one, or hadn't used it.
I used my old router table to make my latest version. Sure, I could have done it without the old one, but why? It would have taken a lot longer, and been a lot less easy if I hadn't used it. Norm knows.
JOAT I do things I don't know how to do, so that I might learn how to do them. - Picasso
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On Wed, 11 Jul 2007 00:05:54 -0000, " snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com"

I remember once he went over to the prototype to get a measurement or angle, can't remember which. I was scratching my head on that one.
-Leuf
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

Occasionally Norm forgets that some small part of his viewing audience are bit creatively challenged....clamping a strait board to cut the initial panel with a skill saw takes years of experience to master.....I know I get completely lost when he trots out his wide belt sander....what to do in my humble shop? I suppose petty nit picking can be entertaining (I'm enjoying this) but in the long run I'm not sure of the value. Rod
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So it bothers you why? Because he uses the best tool available to make the new one?
Not that it matters if you get a single straight edge on the panel you're using. Once you get the guide in the ditch, the blade will make the only straight edge you need on the panel. Square to it with your fence. Until then, factory is all you need.
I used my old "sacrificial" board on my rip fence to make the new one, is that the same thing?
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And many have never used a panel cutter in their lives, yet most manage to make straight square cuts. Who said that a panel cutter was an absolute necessity? It's just a convenience. It they were a necessity, every saw manufacturer would be selling them with their saws at an increased price.
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

Perhaps one could use one of the other 400 ways to make a straight cut on a panel, using whatever tools are on hand?
God forbid he uses his big sander, then what would you do? <G>
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And if I recall correctly, Norm used his old router table to build his new one. Nevertheless, I don't believe there was any point in the process where Norm said "you have to have a panel cutter to make the new panel cutter." I think he was merely demonstrating how handy it is to have one available when cutting a large panel for any type of project that makes use of a large panel -- for example, a panel cutter.
I, myself, am planning to use my version of Norm's panel cutter to make some components for a crosscut sled, which is destined to be the replacement for my -- wait for it -- panel cutter.
Lee
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To e-mail, replace "bucketofspam" with "dleegordon"

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Changing the subject, but regarding another show was Norm was making jigs...
He was making a circle cutting jig for his bandsaw. He used his router with a fence to make a dado down the center of a long board to hold a nut. He then said: I've installed a smaller bit, adjusted my fence, and now I'm going to make a slot right down the center of the dado for a bolt."
I don't have a fence for my router, so maybe I'm missing something, but if I install a smaller bit, wouldn't my slot end up right in the middle of the dado without any fence adjustment?
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wrote:

Yes, but you usually have to move the fence out of the way to change the bit.
-Leuf
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But the true irony is that he demonstrated before making his new panel cutter how wobbly his old one was when in the miter slot.
Allen

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