Yes folks, its cheaper to heat with electricity!

[dennis]

When someone comes up with a viable way to store the electricity generated by these odd schemes then the pros will outweigh the cons. Until then wind power, solar power and almost any other relies on nature generating scheme will need proper backup or customers willing to do without power. If they think I will do without power then they are mistaken and I will have a noisy polluting generator to back it up like most people will. Net environmental damage far higher than the savings!

Wave power is far better than building a tidal barrier and should have less damage.

[Doctor Drivel]

What world are you in? Power is required 24/7. During the night if tidal and wind can manage then other power forms are switched out.

On what do you base this?

[dennis]

"Ohh look its windy lets turn Drax off for 30 minutes." ;-)

The same as the other greens, I decided it is true so it must be.

>

[Jules]

I'm just thinking that after the blackouts start hitting, both politicians and greenies alike will be looking for any solution that works, and there are probably ways and means of getting the planning through in a heartbeat no matter how much the nimby brigade complain.

Of course history says that politicians would rather the country go down the toilet than admit that they made a mistake, but I doubt that the potential for such a far-reaching disaster has been quite this great before.

Time will tell, I suppose :-)

[geoff]

In message , Doctor Drivel writes

When Shrewsbury floods (which it rarely does now that the weir is there) it is due to welsh water, I don't see how doing anything to the estuary past Bristol would have any effect

[Dave Liquorice]

Naw, it'll be:

"Oh look the forcast is for wind in two days time lets run down drax for a week, it'll save 200,000 tonnes of coal.

Two days later.

"What happened to the forecats wind? Drax is still running down and will take a 2 days to run back up anyway.

[Andrew Gabriel]

No they can't. You can't just switch a power station on and off like a light bulb.

Some of our power stations are capable of powering down overnight, but for others, either the startup and shutdown time is longer than overnight, or the economics don't work, so they can't do it.

Any kind of large scale wind generation is only useful if the energy can be stored, as no power stations can cut in and out on the whim of the wind. Otherwise, wind has to remain low enough contribution to the total to be insignificant or it would destablise the grid.

[Doctor Drivel]

Maxie, I was there a few months back and it was flooding. If there is a large buffer 32 foot below high tide the water flows in. When it rises it is then allowed out on the outgoing tide.

[Edward W. Thompson]

snip

I assume you are refering to power station using steam turbines. Gas turbine machines have a compartitively fast startup time and 'two shifting' procedures for steam turbines (not nuclear boiler based) has been used for many years and allows restart within a few hours.

[tony sayer]

In article , Andrew Gabriel scribeth thus

Apart from Dinorwig, suppose its a bit longer than a lightbulb more like a fluorescent or a sodium light ;)....

[Mark Ayliffe]

On or about 2008-04-29, Doctor Drivel illuminated us with:

Umm, Shrewsbury is above the 50m contour. I also can't understand how tidal flooding over 60 miles away can have any effect on flooding there. I can understand Gloucester being affected, but certainly not Shrewsbury. If you read the stuff about it on the EA website, you'll find that flooding there is caused by heavy rain in the catchment area, and tides are not mentioned.

[Chris Shore]

I hope you are right.

Sadly, you are right on this one.

Indeed it will, Most likely in our lifetimes.

[Duncan Wood]

More like a fluorescent than a sodium.

[tony sayer]

In article , Mark Ayliffe scribeth thus

Water "backing up" perhaps?..

[tony sayer]

Anyone got a u-tube vid of the power output meters when the ads on Corrie are 0n;?..

[Jon Green]

Yeah, think of all the kettles that get switched on just after the opening credits...

Jon

[Mark Ayliffe]

On or about 2008-04-30, tony sayer illuminated us with:

Nope. That would put most of Gloucestershire and Herefordshire under water first I think. Also if you look at the photos of the Severn in Shrewsbury during flood (as opposed to the photos of the flooded streets), it's flowing rather fast.

[Francis Turton]

Exactly. Not compared to anything else!

I expect that there will be a government-fed media whitewash about how damaging the new generation coal power stations actually are and the public, as usual, will accept what they want to hear.

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[Andy Wade]

You could download half-hourly demand data from here

plot your own.

Football seems to cause the largest TV-related load pickups, see

[Doctor Drivel]

on in the kitchens and the water company pumps pumping water to cope with the surge.