Wind turbines - can be DIY made?

[Steve Firth]

Said conditions being the evening of 16th October 1987.

[Steve Firth]

You appear to have snipped the part where I referred to Cragside, which was a single, private house.

[Dave Liquorice]

This is true but I expect most other sources are signifcantly above even the generous 1/3 of rate output for a wind turbine. Also bear in mind that this much reduced level is due mainly to there being not enough wind, something that we can't control. Unlike essential maintenance for a hydro, gas or coal station.

[Chris]

A much better thing to DIY than wind turbines methinks. Anyone tired doing this themselves? Its something I've considered doing at some point. (when I don't live in a flat!)

[Dave Liquorice]

1/3 = 0.33 recuring 1/4 = 0.25

So your 0.3 sits between my figures... B-)

Wind is not "the answer" that the meejia and commercial wind companies would have us believe. It has its place, off shore for a start where the wind is better and more predictable but of course it costs rather more to build and maintain turbines off shore which hits the profit margins.

Remember commercial wind companies are *not* building turbines to save the planet they are building them to make money for their multinational parent companies and/or their shareholders.

[Roger]

The message from David Hansen contains these words:

As I said above. Some doesn't have to be very much at all. Why the reluctance to be more precise?

And below 20% the system will work perfectly adequately with no wind input at all. All the wind power is doing is forcing conventional generating capacity into reserve capacity when the wind blows. But if it does that too often some conventional capacity will become uneconomic and be withdrawn. If that happens the generating industry will be up the proverbial creek sans paddle.

No but you just plug windpower.

I thought it was sufficiently obvious not to require spelling it out but just for the record downtime for maintenance and repair has to cover the situation you highlighted.

No. What I think is that you don't have a clue whether or not there is ever a situation in which hydro saved the day. Do you even know how much hydro power is deliberately kept in reserve to cover such an eventuality.

Dinorwig as you very well know is a pump storage scheme whose purpose is to cover peak demand, not to hang around waiting for primary generators to fail.

They? All you have come up with so far is a single pump storage scheme that recycles previously generated electricity at times of peak demand. Lose a major power station and Dinorwig would quickly run out of water.

Not much use then is it?

So what's new? They have been making 500MW sets and planting them in

2000MW power stations for at least 40 years. It hasn't stopped the continuing advancement of transmission and associated control theory so the industry must better place now than it was in the 60s.

[Peter Ashby]

I suppose it depends on how you look at it and if mains 'leccy prices don't increase lots. If they do increase as they may well if we get a carbon tax then the economics change. Also depends on how much carbon it takes you to earn the difference between purchase and savings.

Peter

[Dave Liquorice]

I agree I expect there could be a couple of MW or more available at the bottom of Cow Green but it's miles (literally) from anywhere and I expect the tree huggers would object to a power line being installed or a trench dug across the moors to get the power out.

The local hydro plant had problems with English Nature about the trench required for the 2 x 8" pipes that feed the turbine as it crossed some peat bog and bird breeding grounds. Delayed the start by a good year. Ridiculous I know where the pipes run but you can't tell, same goes for a new 6" water main across the fells as well. 12 months after installation and nature has covered the "scar". I can't see nature doing that to a

400' tall wind turbine or the 30m x 30m x 10m solid concrete block they are built on and isn't removed when decommisioning takes place.

[Huge]

Just as an experiment, I painted an old radiator matt black and propped it up in the garden facing South this summer, then pumped the water from one of those "inflatable" "swimming" pools through it.

I've no scientific data, but after a couple of days, the pool was definitely warmer than it has been in previous years. Worth doing, given that it didn't cost anything, and enough to pique my interest in "proper" solar hot water for the house.

[Mary Fisher]

We did install the kit ourselves in January 2006 and are well pleased. But again, it has to be in the right situation. We're lucky to have a sloping roof facing south and no shade on it

Mary

[Mary Fisher]

So? Surely anything which goes some way to reducing fossil fuel generation is good?

Mary

[Andy Hall]

A lot of ifs there. It would take a lot of economic distortion directed at individuals in order to alter the economics and that probably wouldn't be politically acceptable.

[Paul Herber]

Just pumping the water would warm it up .

[Mary Fisher]

So someone working in a caring profession is only doing it for money and doesn't care about those they serve?

That's the ultimate logic of your statement.

I believe that it's true of some people too, but not all.

Mary

[Matt]

....which just happens to be the size of Godalming

[Andy Hall]

Tax relief?

[David Hansen]

On Thu, 5 Oct 2006 16:22:48 +0100 someone who may be Roger wrote this:-

Because it is a subject that doesn't permit soundbite "answers". Few interesting questions can be answered yes or no. That is why the report is worth reading for those who are interested.

Incorrect, for reasons outlined in the links I have provided.

Incorrect. I "plug" a whole variety of sustainable forms of generation. When someone knocks one of them I will rebut incorrect assertions.

Incorrect. There are hydro schemes which are operated simply to lop the peaks, Sloy is a good example. Dinorwig fulfills a number of purposes. One of these is to cover failures in large power stations.

In a relatively few hours, as the operators state on their web site. However, as I said before in this thread, that gives enough time to resolve the fault or wind up other forms of generation.

Incorrect. It provides base load generation that largely displaces fossil fuelled generation.

[David Hansen]

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 16:40:53 +0100 (BST) someone who may be "Dave Liquorice" wrote this:-

The "tree huggers" have been calling for the proposed upgrade of the transmission line between Beauly and Denny to be put in a trench.

[Steve Firth]

I did something similar using a 1 metre square radiator. I made a box to go around the radiator from sheet aluminium, and glazed the front, insulated the back. It's done great service in Italy providing hot water for a shower. I used an LVM "Amazon" 12V pump to circulate the water and powered that from a 40W solar panel. It starts when the sun comes up and stops when it goes down, pump speed has some relationship to the amount of sun.

Using a two way valve (Gardena hose fitting) I can divert the water to a shower head (Gardena watering rose) inside a shower tent (Actually a toile tent).

It works well, the only problem is it gets way too hot and then I have to spend time mixing in cold or face the wrath of SWMBO when she gets scalded.

[Steve Firth]

It started as a rather modest hunting lodge. But size doesn't matter, as Drivel says to his wife.