WIN10EXIT: Don't upgrade if Samsung

[T i m]

+1

Cheers, T i m

[John Rumm]

I was deliberately being a little conservative, however 15 may be pushing it a bit. Many of the separate card solutions then were proprietary and not interchangeable. Quite a few of the early 2000's machines did not yet have WiFi as standard IIRC.

(or even ethernet for that matter; I remember buying a new Dell Lattitude about that time, and had to buy a modem and ethernet on a 3Com PCMCIA card!)

[Weatherlawyer]

So, obviously it won't run on Linux either. And yet?

If all those amateurs can do it... Not just one or two extremely good ones...

[Weatherlawyer]

I do rememeber having problems with getting Linux working on some nefarious system once but then I got hold of Ultimate Edition and never had that experience again.

Here is a daft one concerning regional discs . Windows 7 tells me I need to reset my computer to allow it to play region 2. What on earth is tha silliness about. No version of Linux bothers with that sort of thinking.

[Halmyre]

Wow, ancient history! I remember colleagues and I using laptops the size, weight and shape of a couple of paving slabs with PCMCIA modems to dial in to customers' servers and running pcAnywhere. Ah, happy times, said nobody, ever.

[The Natural Philosopher]

That's cos linux drives a cart and horse through most DRM.

Sadly not e-books though. I have almost given up the thought of buying ebooks, because reading them is so difficult and anyway, you don't 'own' them. You just rent them it seems.

Meanwhile, on a happier note,. its now established that Windows is more malicious than a virus....

Ransomware.

I wonder how long before the rush to Linux gets under way...

[T i m]

If it's this

the guy seems to have been smoking some pretty strong stuff! ;-)

I'm not sure I really get what UE is (other than yet another Linux respin)?

Reset or set. I bought a new DVDRW for a laptop I was sorting for a mate and the *drive* needed setting for the right DVD region (like many DVDs and players are, not just those running Windows).

I don't think I've ever tried to play a DVD on a Linux box and especially not a BluRay. Can you play Blurays on Linux OOI?

Does UE support the iTunes Music Store and playing Windows games, Photoshop and my vehicle diagnostics software do you know please?

I have Linux (dual boot) on nearly all my hardware so have a pretty good idea of what works (especially OOTB), what sort_of_works (network printers that will print but not scan) and what simply doesn't work, or can't be made work unless you are willing to take up programming as a new hobby or interest.

So, what worries me, is just how bad does Windows have to get (according to some) before Linux becomes a real / viable option for the masses? I mean, it's free (of cost, few care about any other type), works (to some degree and that's getting better) on most std hardware and has support for most of the basic software (WEB browsers, Email, Office apps etc). The *problem* is it doesn't (and never likely to) have support for things millions (billions?) of people need like iTunes (to access the iTMS) and real MS Office (for people working together and need change control) and some of the more specialist hardware and software.

Being 'free' (of cost) doesn't seem to be a real draw for anyone I've offered Linux to (supplied and installed for free) and many that I have given Linux to with it all running and working as well as it can (eg, No iTunes support) carry on using Windows because (they tell me) 'they prefer it' and often for some little thing that is important to them they can't do or get going.

So it seems it's a bit like lawnmower racing. Very few know about it and most of those who do aren't interested in it (watching or trying) but those who are into it are or become fanatical advocates, on one hand, trying to introduce the sport to others but on the other, not willing to really offer to help others get started or want to share their minority interest hobby with anyone else.

If I had the time or interest to get one going, I'd probably enjoy it, if only for one race. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

[T i m]

Yeah, me too. After all, it's been around a while now, it's free (of cost) and getting easier to install on most (reasonably modern) hardware and many of the mainstream distros (like Ubuntu and Mint), comes with a pretty comprehensive suite of apps that should cover the needs of most, and doesn't need as much AV software etc.

Now, there have been several instances where Linux could have increased it's userbase, Windows ME, Vista, W8,8.1 and even W10 but over and over, nothing seems to change. ;-(

The only way I can see it getting a foothold amongst ordinary computer users (most of whom have no interest in computers or programming) this late in the (desktop / laptop) game is or it to be available in a generic form 'The Linux' [1] that is officially supported by most of the hardware manufacturers and software developers and available at a

*much* reduced cost on pre installed machines.

Only then (or maybe not even then) some people might be bothered to take a look, but as soon as someone finds they can't run iTunes or their GPS / mobile phone software, or even MS Office for that matter and especially their favourite PC game, they will be asking the likes of me to install Windows 10 on it instead. ;-(

March 2003, Linux 2.2% March 2016, Linux 5.5% (and seems to have been stuck around 5% since

2010).

Cheers, T i m

[1] And it won't of course because all the 'geeks' will have a fit because it goes against the whole open / free / forked_beyond_belief concept that has been holding Linux back for so long.

[Theo]

'Centrino' was the first major push for wifi in laptops - that was 2003. I've definitely swapped out the wireless card on a 2004 Centrino laptop.

Theo

[John Rumm]

Yup that was a complete chipset solution so more standardised than previously. (even if Intel did get into trouble with the advertising regulators for neglecting to mention the whole "work anywhere" bit was only true when near a WiFi network!)

[Andy Burns]

Looking back to when I bought the machine I was thinking of, yes it was only 13 years ago.

My Latitude D800 had gigabit wired but only 11Mbps WiFi, I had to grey import a bluetooth module for it, eventually it was upgraded to 54Mbps WiFi.

[Vir Campestris]

the story I heard was:

Hollywood spoke to MS, and asked them nicely if they'd help out with the regional protection scam. MS agreed.

The Linux guys response was short and Anglo-Saxon.

Andy

[T i m]

You still often have to jump though hoops to do 'everyday' stuff in Linux though (and accept the restrictions).

"None of these options are perfectly convenient, but it?s what we have for now?and at least it (mostly) works."

Cheers, T i m

[John Rumm]

The protection is built into the DVD drives themselves these days (RPC2 rather than RPC1). That means you can only set the region a limited number of times before the drive permanently locks to the region. Obviously you can opt to let the drive fail to decrypt and do it in software later these days (AnyDVD being one of the nicest solutions IMHO). There are also sites that carry modified firmware for lots of the drives to make them RPC1.

(MS have given up on DVD these days it seems - you don't even get a DVD player program included with recent versions of windows)

[The Natural Philosopher]

I want aware that any drives had De-DRM hardware. It thoughyt it was all done in software.

There is an issue with linux in that some distros say 'oh dear, we cant supply the decrypt libs because its illegal, so you will have to find them somewhere else' --->

Anyway as far as I am concerned its all been a massive own goal. The way I work is to buy the digital whatever, rip it by whatever means are possible, and put it on my server where all my devices can get at it.

If they stop me doing that, I simply don't buy it at all.

DRM has made reading e-books less reliable than buying the paper. Pure Ludditeism.

[dennis]

That's because they have to pay royalties to include it, unlike Linux where they just point the user to somewhere they can steal it.

[The Natural Philosopher]

No, you don't steal the DE DRM program, anymore than you steal a key to unlock your briefcase full of books.

The theft is arguably by the media companies who demand payment to let you view their content, when you have already bought the right to do just that.

The legal situation of ripping a DVD is very much not clear. The legal situation of providing the tools to do it is much clearer. Its almost certainly not against the law of the country you download it from or here either.

It might be against Californian law, but what isn't?

I just realised I spent 5 minutes giving a sensible answer to dennis. Before realising that as per usual, he's got the wrong end of the stick completely and is al twitter and bisted about his fanboi OS, Winders, being crap, as usual.

[dennis]

If its not your key and you don't have permission to use it then you have stolen it. If you lose your car key you don't go out and steal someone else's, you go and buy a new one. Well us honest folk do.

They own the copyright, its theirs to do as they want or do you think everything is GPL? Do you steal other peoples software and other ideas too?

It may be sensible to you but its also wrong.

Linux doesn't ship with a licensed DVD player as it wouldn't be free if it did ship with a licensed DVD player. Then who would download it?

Its illegal in the UK to bypass DRM such as that on DVDs.

The linux distributors rely on the user downloading software and committing the crime.

Not that anyone cares much as long as they don't rip it and upload it to t'internet or car boot sales.

Looking at that bit of the post I think its easy to see who is bitter and twisted and its not me.

[The Natural Philosopher]

But oince I have downloaded it it ios my key and I do have permission to use it

If I lose my car keys I Have the bloody locks changed.

They may own the copyright but that doesn't mean they own the copy.

No it isn't.

In the EU, if it isn't for commercial purposes, its not a crime.

There is no crime. Its legal to rip DVDs as long as you don't sell the ripped copy in.

EU equivalent of law of Tort applies. No gain, no pain.

[Adrian Caspersz]

Use of libdvdcss is free and not illegal here/EU. In the US the situation is different as they observe software patents. In the event no keys were stolen to create that software library which is widely used on Linux and Windows. The ancient DeCSS is another matter.