Water Saving

[Alex]

Well you can split water into hydrogen and oxygen. However the problem is that the water is in the wrong place, not that there's a shortage overall.

Alex.

[Alex]

Sorry, but that's really not the case, at least in the south east. Our reservoirs are getting very low, and there's a very real chance we will run out. See the front page here for information:

[Douglas de Lacey]

Right on! And Global Warming is a myth put about by anti-American weenies, there's a superabundance of oil down there, we can dispose easily of all our waste by digging bigger and bigger holes, the Third World isn't really poor, and AIDS and avian flu are all in the mind.

Dream on, brother.

Douglas de Lacey.

[The3rd Earl Of Derby]

The swimming pools in the garden must go. ;-)

-- Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

[TheScullster]

"Doctor Drivel" wrote

How does the energy requirement of a pump to provide the circulation compare to the cost of water saving?

Sounds like more of a luxury than a cost saving feature!

Phil

[Douglas de Lacey]

Sadly this is not true. Indeed, paradoxicaly here in East Anglia we are promised standpipes in the street this summer, together with significant flooding in over-populated parts (eg where the gummint is forcing us to build huge housing estates on known flood-plains). The (UK) problem is largely water *management*, but we cannot just build ever-larger reservoirs to get out of trouble. And as the globe heats up precipitation patterns will change (and presumably more water will stay in vapour form).

The only reason given was "water is declining". That's not an unreasonable way of looking at it.

Douglas de Lacey

[Doctor Drivel]

The pumnp is not run continuously, a pipe stat holds it off when the loop is up to temp.

Firstly it "saves" water and reduces the water bill. The longer the dead-leg DHW pipe runs the more the saving. Until the recent gas price hypes, most households spend as much on water as on heating the house. Having instant hot water at the taps is a real convenience well worth having. Most people do not use hot water when washing their hands in the cloakroom as the hot water take too long to come through.

It saves money and is a great convenience. They must be on a timer so as not to operate at night. Some have them off the DHW CH timeclock as many people with highly insulted cylinders leave the DHW on all day. Heat loss is vastly reduced with high performing insulated cylinders. The DHW secondary loop must also be insulated to reduce heat loss too.

Well worth having if done properly.

[Doctor Drivel]

It is? Strange in that al the world's major scientists on the topic say global warming is happening, even the US ones too.

And we can choke opurselves to death in burning it too.

It isn't?

It is?

And he is posting from a snotty uni too. That says it all.

What cloud are you bouncing from?

[Doctor Drivel]

Water is the right place. People decide to live in the wrong places. Takes your choice.

[Doctor Drivel]

infrastructure to pump from one region to another. Then the hardness may vary throughout the year. Also they should repair the leaks in their underground pipes instated of paying dividends.

[Mary Fisher]

Mary

[pen]

Here in Gibraltar water has always been an issue. Our mains water is now desalinated - tastes foul but at least we don't run out in summer. It's metered and billed monthly. Some of the locals are such tightwads that, having worked out that a minimum flow of water is needed to register on the meter, they set up taps to drip overnight into buckets so that they can have some "free" water! We also have a separate, unmetered, strained salt water network for flushing lavatories.

Pen

[The Natural Philosopher]

Not half as much as the loss of heat circulating how water through a cold roof does.

It is.

[Tony Bryer]

I don't deny the amenity value, but would challenge you to show how this will save money.

The last time I checked metered water was 90p per cubic metre (1000 litres): assume it's doubled since. 10m of 15mm copper tube contains about 1/8 litre - 8000 draw-offs saves £1.80. If you can do your timer, return leg and pump for £100 you'd be doing well. So by the time you get to 450,000 draw-offs you'll have recovered the installation cost by the water saved. It's just that in the meantime those pipes have continuously been losing expensive heat for x hours a day instead of just once between each use. Yes you'd save money on water more quickly on a longer dead leg but then you'd be spending even more keeping the water hot - Google wouldn't quickly give me a figure for the heat loss from an insulated copper pipe.

[meow2222]

That page offered nothing at all to substantiate the alleged water shortage. The reality is we have such an excess of water we can water our gardens all day any day we want. We have masses more than we need.

Do you not notice these stories help to keep water prices as high as poss, help to get politicos on the side of water metering and price hikes, and condition the public to accept ever rising prices?

The day water gets short we'll adopt the aussie methods of conservation. Aerators on taps, dangly things that only let water out when your hand is right under the tap, "If its yellow its mellow, if its brown flush it down" and so on.

We have so much we can and do throw lots away every day.

NT

[Brian Sharrock]

Actually ....; even with the base price quoted it is (approximately) double : 'they' sting you for the water supplied _and_ for the waste removed [my supplier 'allows' five percent off the quantity presumably 'they' reckon I perspire and/or urinate outside the house!]

Concur with the economics.argument Saving water while wasting heat isn't too good.

[Mary Fisher]

You might.

[Pete C]

Not in certain areas, to do so would mean reservoirs and boreholes running dry, then there will be no water for essential uses.

Not where it's needed, it's a regional problem.

Prices will rise to some extent, due to increasing plant, machinery and employee costs. Should the employees go without a pay rise for the next 10 years?

It's already short in certain areas.

This is why meters make sense, should the low user pay the same towards investment as idiots want to waste as much as they want?

cheers, Pete.

[Doctor Drivel]

Most dead-legs waste about 2 litres of water, and in larger homes even more, and you may have a number of them around the house. Large parts of the dead-legs are 22mm pipe. With a large family the water wastage from dead-legs is substantial.

Not if they are fully insulated they will not.

A secondary loop is one of those things that once you have one you would always have another.............and it saves you money on water bills too. A sort of win, win.

[Doctor Drivel]

There is such a thing as heavy pipe insulation.