Tiling hall

[Kit Jackson]

I'm about to tile the hall of an old Victorian house. Total tile area approx 16m2 of 8mm thick faux Victorian tiles. Proposing to put 12mm plywood over 22mm floorboards.

Can anyone tell me the recommended fixing for the plywood to the floor please? Are the screws supposed to be at 6", 8", 12" centres or something else. Tight joins between the plywood sheets? Is it OK to leave a 5-10mm gap all round at the walls to make it easier to get the plywood into position? What screws do you recommend? I'd like to screw straight down without having to put a separate clearance hole in the plywood or countersink it. I don't want to screw down into the floor joists for fear of catching the central heating pipes which have been recessed into the top of the joists.

Finally I've been told I need flexible tile adhesive. Any recommendations please?

Thanks

[stuart noble]

I can never see the point of floorboards AND ply, which normally creates steps at the doorways. If the joists are firm, just the ply would probably be enough

[Tim Watts]

I'd use 6"

Yes - in fact run a bed of glue along the edge.

Yes - in fact it is a good idea to permit a little expansion and movement (wood is not 100% rigid).

Screw-Tites - 5mm shank, and long enough to go into the joists.

The above will allow that.

Can you not determine where these are first?

Mapei - see their website, the range of options are there. "Class 2" are the magic words you want. Don't forget flexible grout (Mapei do an additive that is admixed into their regular powdered grouts).

[Roger Mills]

True, but it can be a right pain removing the floorboards. Much easier to board over them to smooth out any irregularities.

[Tricky Dicky]

Screw spacings should be 6", Turbogold & Turbosilver will do the job, self drilling and countersinking. There is no need to screw through to the joist s at 6" spacing so just use a length long enough to thread into the floorbo ards. Never lay tiles directly onto floorboards unless it is already ply or chipboard the movement In the boards will have your tiles up in no time an d I speak from experience having recently had to take up a bathroom floor l aid by the previous owner.

Richard

[newshound]

+1 for going straight into floorboards with any good pozidrive screw, but I think I would tend to have a pilot hole (they will self-countersink). I think I would go for ~ 12 inch spacings along the centre line of each floorboard, with the holes staggered by 6 inches on adjacent floorboards, if you see what I mean.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Or just repair the floorboards if needed and make sure they are well screwed down. Fixing ply to loose floorboards is still going to leave loose floorboards. Unless you fix through the boards to the joists.

The adhesive will take up any unevenness.

[GB]

Is that 6" all over, in each direction?!!! That's a hell of a lot of screws for 16 m2. Back-breaking work with an ordinary drill driver, and it will take ages.

(That's 711 screws for 16 m2, according to my calculator.)

[Stephen]

Firstly screw down every single floorboard. Avoid nails totally.

Then look at the "NoMorePly" system on Google....

You can buy the NoMorePly sheets, screws and adhesive.

The three main benefits are that:

NoMorePly sheets are thinner so less steps at door ways

NoMorePly does not rot when in contact with water whereas ply does

And witgh the supplied adhesive, all the edges can be glued down as well as screwed.

I've been using this stuff for years, I'll never go back to PLy especially in bathrooms, shower rooms and kitchens.

[Tim Watts]

Interesting product.

The only thing that might concern me is if you ever need to lift the floor. I know either way, that is going to lead to taking all the tiles up - but at least screwed ply will then come up cleanly. This on the other hand looks pretty permanent if it's all glued down with foaming PU adhesive all over. Did I understand the last bit?

[Charles Hope]

"The Gas Man cometh" ....

[GB]

And pulled up all the new tiles, all the ply, and a good deal of the floorboards. Of course, he's going to unscrew 700+ individual screws, all with tile adhesive in the top of the screw where the driver bit goes, so the ply comes up cleanly. :)

[Chris French]

Pilot holes aren't needed - will just take a lot longer to do the job. They will screw straight through the ply quite happily. Another recommendation as well for Screwtite screws from Toolstation. Though really any modern pozidrive C/S head screw will do the job.

I probably wouldn't go for 6 inches - spacing, 8-12 sounds fine to me. Then again better to put in to many that have some moving ply later.

[Tricky Dicky]

Using ply will overcome movement in the underlying floorboards but the ply needs to be screwed down so as to remove any bounce hence the 6" spacing. U sing thicker ply might enable you to increase the spacing. As far as time s pent I used approx. 150 turbo silver screws, no pilot holes needed and they all self countersunk time taken probably less than an hour.

Richard

[Stephen]

Its low foaming adhesive, nothing like expanding foam....

You can use a SDS drill and a flat angled chisel to lift the old tiles up and then a wall paper scraper to get the old adhesive off. You can then retile without ever taking up NoMorePly.

[Tim Watts]

I know what it is - having used quite a lot!

And my point stands - it will be excellent if you *never* need to lift the floor. If you do, well, rather you than me!

How does that let you get to the pipes underneath - that the OP has?

Quite frankly, as there are pipes, and probably wires, underneath, I'd dump the idea of tiles - pop some hardboard down and lay vinyl.

Good vinyl is underrated and tiles overrated (unless on concrete floors).

[The Natural Philosopher]

In general the MTBF of well laid cables and pipes exceeds the MTTFC (meant time to fashion change*) that SWMBO will have burned into her firmware.

So when the new shit goes in, sort the pipes and cables out. Or wait till the pipes and cables fail and use that to trigger the changes she's been nagging about for the last decade

*as defined when the must have avocado suite and chocolate shag carpet simply has to be replaced with Victorian white china and black and white tiles, which is what it replaced in the first place.

[Tim Watts]

Yes indeed - but now you have to unbond square yards of board held down with PU adhesive.

I cannot see that being fun.

[The Natural Philosopher]

rip the lot up with a chainsaw.

[Andy Burns]

I've been looking into this ready for tiled bathroom floor, is NoMorePly really any different from the Hardiebacker or Aquapanel boards?

Apart from a couple of floorboards that suffered from being in a damp corner (and will be replaced) they are in good nick, and the area is only 4x6' and has no noticeable "bounce"

I need to to work out the total floor depth (ply or cement board) plus adhesive and tiles before starting as the sliding pocket door has to be packed to finished floor level before I start anything else ...