Thickness of ceiling joists in loft

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wrote:

Of course! Look at the American Indians and many other ethnic communities where Britain sent its colonial "missionaries" - and promptly gave the indigenous population a disease which their immune system had not yet encountered. They dropped like flies. I believe it is vital that we mix as much as possible. Who remembers the dances at the Hammersmith Palais and other venues? They really got the germs a-flyin'! Along with the arms and the legs and the inhibitions.

That's another thing I do, too. Always be aware that the person before you, serving you, giving you change etc may have just returned from Number Twos without washing the hands. I never touch the faceplate or handles on doors in public spaces, such as multistorey car parks, but look for an area to push or pull that is less likely to be contaminated.

How many people wash their hands before eating a sandwich at lunch? That is, they could have just shaken hands with the flash salesman from the London branch, who only a few minutes before was fondling the office bike in the stationery cupboard. Chlamydia with that BLT, anyone...?
MM
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On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 00:39:02 +0000, Mike Mitchell

Presumably you accept that the taxes you pay also contribute to hospitals, which you rarely use? As far as I'm concerned if one of my family is in need of urgent attention then I'm happy to pay a contribution to ensure that an ambulance turns up.
As for children, these are tomorrows wage earners and tax payers. Later on in life you will most likely benefit from them paying their taxes.
There is also the small issue of these people having to buy things to eat and survive, cars, other adornments, etc. This emerging generation are tomorrows customers for your business (and for some businesses are the actual customer).
PoP
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Of course I accept it! I am not the one arguing against free commuting in Belgium! I am all in favour of it here as well.
MM
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On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:51:02 +0000, Mike Mitchell

Sorry, I guess IMM has been at his tricks again. One of these days I must read his responses, but it's much more fun twit-filtering him and then trying to figure out what he's said when someone else responds ;)
PoP
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I apologise for the additional effort, however the level of unsolicited email I receive makes it impossible to advertise my real email address!
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wrote:

What the hell are you on about?
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"Mike Mitchell" wrote | My ex-council house semi is basic in design, but built like the | proverbial brick "outhouse". Since all the internal walls, ground | floor and first floor, are of solid masonry, the joists in the | loft seem really strong with no discernible spring when one steps | along one. The joists are now partially boarded over, but I was | wondering what a brand new house is like in the loft. In a modern | house, the walls are usually stud type, i.e. not load-bearing. | So how strong are the ceiling joists in the loft in a modern | house? How to they stay up without load-bearing walls to support | them?
The ceiling joists in a modern house have very little weight to carry (only a plasterboard ceiling and some insulation). Their main purpose is to stop the ends of the roof (and walls) spreading outwards, so they are held in tension which helps stop sagging, and they will often be diagonally braced to the rafters, both supporting and being supported.
Owain
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On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:35:51 -0000, "Owain"

Can one walk on them though?
MM
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Give me an ex-local authority house anytime. They are BUILT, not like todays rubbish. Yes ok, they may not be upto today's modern insulation standards but in 5 years time, the modern houses will probably not meet the standards of the day either.
wrote:

(only
stop
braced
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todays
All that cold and damp! Oh no! If you want a modern well built solid house they are there. You find them and buy one, or build your own.
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In my flat the beams are maybe a little less than 2x4s spaced 600mm or so apart, and they span 18 feet. They form the bottom part of a braced "A" frame structure that is the roof. There's a single stud wall in the middle which I no doubt provides a little bit of support. The beams can support my weight but there's no way I could make the space into a liveable space like that. I'm sure over time the ceiling would sag. Tncidentally the builders put down a length of chipboard flooring, to to the electrics or lay the insulation or something but they couldn't be bothered to lift the board up (which isn't nailed or anything) to put insulation under it! That's how I know the ceiling can suport my weight 'cos I've been adding extra insulation recently.
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wrote:

(only
stop
braced
he obviously knows nothing about this, yet comments as if he is an authority. Some mothers....
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IMM wrote

Are you the Pot or the Kettle?
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I just "know" that's all.
As I said...Some mothers....
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Yes. Or at least, I can in my loft, which is of the "million matchstick" construction described. "Walk" is a bit strong, since I cannot stand up in there.
I much prefered the loft in my house in Barnet which was held up by 6 pieces of wood.
--
"The road to Paradise is through Intercourse."
[email me at huge [at] huge [dot] org [dot] uk]
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Frequently, even in modern houses, there is a masonry wall in the middle that rises to loft level (there was in my last house). Also, don't assume that stud walls are non structural. Many houses are built entirely from structural stud walls without any masonry in sight (except maybe a decorative brick shell).
Christian.
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On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:11:29 -0000, "Christian McArdle"

It usually depends on the size of the house, larger modern houses have a brick wall in the middleish upstairs whereas a smaller house, (below a decent sized 3 bed), have the upstairs entirely of paramount, or occasionally studwork. That's the way all the houses I've wired in the last few years have been, and there's at least a good few hundred, in different areas, by different house builders. They all build houses exactly the same. ..
SJW A.C.S. Ltd.
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wrote:

That is changing fast. TJI "I" beams are now being commonly used. A smaller house with a short truss span does not require mid point support.
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Language! What does TJI mean?
MM
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wrote:

Trus Joist McMillan I beams http://www.masonite.se
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On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:11:29 -0000, "Christian McArdle"

But I would never contemplate buying one of those. I can get garden sheds at B & Q.
MM
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