solar panels

[Doctor Drivel]

Like over 50% of all panels in the world.

[Stuart Noble]

A bonus for tourism in Greece where, because there is no winter season, the system only ever has to heat bathroom water. No boilers, no maintenance, or health and safety considerations.

I think maybe you're on thin ice with aesthetics. When something is obviously beneficial to society, we tend to accept it visually. Telegraph poles, electricity pylons etc. It could become viable here if prices drop far enough and we'll have to learn to love the new landscape. We could paint faces on the water tanks and give them names

[Doctor Drivel]

Nannied? What are you babbling about?

[Doctor Drivel]

To dismiss hyronic solar space heating systems out of hand is a bit silly. OK, with a nice site and new design, a new superinsulated house designed properly and built to passive solar principles can work.

If you have an existing house and renovating then matters become different. Solar air heaters knock cobs off a wet system, but a conservatory is really needed and heat is difficult to store. A south facing roof that is made into one complete wet panel, using a large 2,000 litre plus thermal store and very low temp UFH is feasible indeed, and in winter too as it can store a couple days heat when cloudy.

The cost when doing a renovation is not that great, as probably the roof needed doing anyway, you were installing UFH anyway, etc. So, the cost over and above what you would have paid is the cost.

Don't dismiss hydronic systems.

[Doctor Drivel]

It is. CAT did this in an interseasonal store. Not cost effective for the average house.

[Doctor Drivel]

Matt, is the forces of evil itself.

[Mary Fisher]

I agree. Most of the technology we see around us is not aesthetically pleasing, there are very few beautiful cars, commercial vans and lorries and the like are ugly. Even most houses aren't pretty. Nor are the people who live in them ... Attempts to make washing machines beautiful by having rounded corners doesn't really cut the mustard. One wouldn't put up a mobile phone mast just to adorn one's plot.

All those things are in full view of people almost all the time. Solar water heating panels are usually on the roof, they are more of less part of the roof. They look like Velux windows - if you bother to look upwards and most people don't. If you do look upwards you'll see some of the ugliest creations of Man - civil aircraft.

At worst SWH panels are aesthetically neutral, at best novel.

PV panels, on the other hand, are astonishingly beautiful in my opinion, like CDs. IMO.

Mary

[Owain]

Paint roundels on them and use them for target practice.

Owain

[Doctor Drivel]

This woman has style.

[Peter Lynch]

This just goes to show how invisible technology becomes. When you talked about looking up I was certain you were going to refer to TV aerials.

The thing is, it is perfectly possible to make household appliances look pretty, but people aren't prepared to pay. When it comes to the crunch, most people don't mind what their hoovers/cars/houses look like provided next-door's looks the same.

Pete

[Mary Fisher]

There are too many uglinesses to choose from but aircraft are doubly ugly because of their noise. Triply because of their pollution but that's another story.

Our house and its appliances aren't pretty but they're not the same as the neighbours'. They were decades ago .. :-)

Mary

[Andy Hall]

That's a bit strong. He's never been that unkind about you.

[Andy Hall]

Absolutely not.

Except that this isn't.

Secondly, people don't make purchasing decisions based on things being "beneficial to society". They do so based on their pocketbooks and that's it.

[Andy Hall]

and.....

[Owain]

Mine used to look the same until I discovered stencils and spray-paint.

Owain

[AJH]

My recollection was that it was neither cost effective or effective at all.

AJH

[The Natural Philosopher]

Radiators spring to mind. Horrible things. Spawn of the devil. Another wall where you cant pout a bookcase or a sofa.

Bloody ugly things water towers. Why they just don;t heap up household rubbish into a sort of long barrow, and put a tree ringed reservoir on top beats me.

[Doctor Drivel]

It did work after a few amendments here than there.

[Doctor Drivel]

Matt??

[Doctor Drivel]

Matt, like over 50% of all panels in the world.