Single light switch controlling 2 lighting circuits

In my living room I currently have a single light which is controlled by a single switch.

I have put in a number of halogen lights which now all trigger off the single switch

I am looking to put some X10 control onto these lights such that there are two circuits: Circuit 1 controls 3 lights & Circuit 2 controls 2 lights.

I am more than happy about how to convert the single circuit to 2 with the X10 moules turning on the lights but I would also like the old light switch to still work i.e. flick the old light switch and it turns on both circuits

The bit I am struggling on is how to wire this is that if you put the switch to both circuits then it will cause a short on the X10 modules thus turning all lights on when either X10 circuit is switched on.

Is it just a case of using the switch to turn on relay triggered feeds (thus isolating each circuit? If so would some normal 240V 3A ones be OK? i.e.

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The only limitation with this is you could not have them dimmable.)

Is there a way of doing this keeping the main dimmer with the capability of dimming all lights?

[2 Light Circuit = 100W] [3 Light Circuit = 150W]
Reply to
Rob Convery
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Simple answer is no. You need a switch that controls the X10 modules in the same way as the remote unit would. Using relay switching on this type of circuit configuration needs controls that cause them to act in the same way at all times, so one normal on/off switch isn't going to do this. You would need to use a two gang two way switch system that controls the X10 modules, and is separated from direct connection with the two lighting circuits. The X10 modules would also need to be two way switching so that when you operate them to control the lighting, they also separate themselves from the switching control of the two gang switch.

It would work just like this. When the two gang switch on the wall is operated to bring the lights on, the switches would not directly switch the live feed to the lighting circuits, but would use the X10 modules to do the actually switching of the lights. When the remote unit is used, it also uses the X10 modules to do all the switching, and therefore, because they are two way switches, they can change the supply away from the wall switches and over to the remote unit to give full control again.

Wouldn't it be easier to use a remote unit wall switch like these:

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Reply to
BigWallop

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>The reason I may as well go to X10 is because i have a projector screen which is X10 controlled and in the future I am looking to get X10 automated curtains so X10 light control would be the best way to go.

So essentally i need a wall dimmer that controls the two X10 light modules. Not quite what I was looking for as the current wall unit already has another dimmer in it for another lights. 3 Dimmers in 1 unit I think might be pushing it

Reply to
Rob Convery

Why do you need X10 - can't you just wire two switches?

Use a double pole switch (these are more common in 20A and probably won't look exactly like a 5A lightswitch - using a single gridswitch may be a closer aesthetic match) as the 'master' switch. This won't short the two outputs when the switch is off.

0------|--------lights1,2 / 0 / / o/p from dimmer -----------0 A / B \ 0 \ | 0------|--------lights3,4,5

Switch A is a SPDT (2-way) lightswitch which selects either lights 1,2 or lights 3,4,5. This ensures that there is always some lights connected to the dimmer, both from the electrical perspective of not operating the dimmer on no load, and the safety aspect of having some light on as soon as the main switch is operated.

Switch B is a SPST (1-way) lightswitch wired between the L1 and L2 terminals of the 2-way switch, and selects all lights regardless of the position of switch A.

Both switches could be ceiling pull switches if you want to avoid running new cables to the wall switch.

An alternative might be to use an all on master switch. This needs the individual switches to be SPDT (2-way) with the master switch connected to the L2s.

live-----X--------0 | \ sw1 | \ | 0---------light1 | / | / | ###0 | # | # | # X--------0 | # \ sw2 | # \ | # 0---------light2 | # / | # / | ###0 | # | # | ###0 | \ master sw | \ |----------0

The master on wire is shown ####, X indicates a join.

I would just rewire the halogens properly on separate switches, and not bother dimming them. Dimming halogens is very inefficient.

Owain

Reply to
Owain

I would love to rewire it but that would mean ripping up 3 rooms of carpets & floorboards, cutting out new channels in the livingroom and then refinishing / painting it all. Think I would rather just spend £100 or so and sort it using X10 (X10 due to having other X10 controlled devices and not wanting another remote)

Reply to
Rob Convery

would work fine. I have a similar setup for the outside lights here, which are all turned on by a wall switch, and just some of them turned on by a PIR.

I'm not sure if understand you correctly but clearly the relay coil won't respond reliably to a dimmed input signal. But there's no reason why it shouldn't switch a dimmed signal. Could you explain more fully?

Reply to
Mike Barnes

What I meant is the relay solution is 1 but will not enable wall mounting dimming. Is there solution that will.

Currently I think I am going to go slightly differently where I don't have 2 seperate curcuits but the 2nd set of lights which are located above the projector screen can be isolated i.e. turned off when the projector is on or light the other lights when the projector is off.

TO do this I need an X10 module to go in the light switch which supports wall mounted dimmers and then an X10 module which acts as a 240v relay

Reply to
Rob Convery

I'm still not sure I understand, but assuming you want to use X10 for switching and your existing wall switch for dimming and master off... you could use two X10 modules to drive relays, and use the contacts of those relays to connect the dimmed output from the wall switch to the lamps.

If that's not what you're after, forget I spoke...

Reply to
Mike Barnes

An easy way to do this, if you lose the dimmer, is to run the fitting to switch cable at low voltage, and use all cores for control. Fit a miniature transformer wherever the mains supply is, ie fitting or wall switch, and pass 6v etc upto the fittings. There 2 relays turn switched lv to switched mains.

Another way is to fit a --- cant think of the name, but its a type of relay with multiple positions on a rotary cam. Use a momentary press switch on the wall, push once and the relay advances one click. Your relay has 4 positions, off, a on, b on, both on.

Etc... I'd forget dimmers in most cases. If you split your halos into 2 banks with power ratio 2:1 then you'll get 3 power settings, 1/3, 2/3,

  1. Mix the bulb positioning between each sircuit so that each setting gives reasonable light distribution.

NT

Reply to
bigcat

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