show pump in the loft

[sbb]

Hello all and thanks for reading and for any replies in advance.

I have an old showferorce turbo shower pump installed in the loft for a mixer shower which ceased up sometime ago and now the seals have gone and it started to drip.

I went out and bought what I thought and advised was pretty much like for like a Bristan varispeed water pump 50. I installed it onto the same place using the same fitting and have 2 problems.

The first one being that it says no to install in the loft due to the fact it could freeze. Is this a real problem, if it was wouldnt I of had issues with the showerforce one which was there when I moved in.

Also the pump does not work anyway, i.e no water at all and the pump does not kick in. I have test the voltage and it looks ok. Could this be because it is installed in the wrong place. I.e it about 1 foot below the cold water tank in the loft and above the hot water cylinder in the airing cupboard. But again wouldnt this of been an issue with the old one also.

Thanks again in advance for any advice.

Spence.

[Bob Minchin]

Have you got any water flow under gravity? Could well be an air lock and with only 1' head this is not likely to clear itself. Connect a mains pressure hose to the shower outlet (usually 1/2" bsp) and drive any air back into the header tank.

Bob

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Is there not a spec with it for minimum head? Negative head pumps are available for where needed.

IMHO, there's only one make worth considering for a decent life - Stuart Turner.

[Andy Burns]

Wouldn't you need a "negative head" pump for installation in the loft?

[sbb]

Hi Bob, Thanks for the reply and I apologize for my lock of knowledge. There was water flow with the old pump which must of still let water through when it was off somehow when the new one does not. When I turned the mains off and drained the cold tank there was flow until the tank emptied.

What will connecting mains water do to the hot feed ? and do you mean turn the mains back on which will cause the cold tank to fill and then connect a mains supply to the shower head.

Again sorry if I am asking a stupid question but If either the hot feed or cold feed has an air lock, wouldn't I get either just hot or cold. ?

And should I worry about the warnings of installing it in the loft ?.

Thanks again Spence.

[Fredxx]

Connecting mains to the pump output will blast air back into the cold water tank, and the hot water tank, by setting the thermostaic valve to cold and hot respectively. It'll also prime the pump if it's necessary.

[sbb]

Hiya David, There spec says the shower head should be 230mm below the water level in the cold water tank in the loft which it easily is, the only diff is that in the diagrams, the pump is next to the hot water tank and not in the loft and it does say it should be Ideally by the tank :(

Sounds like the shop sold me the wrong one or should this still work anyway

Thanks, Spence.

[sbb]

Hi Andy, Doesnt a "negative head" basically mean you have to manually switch the pump in cases whrere there is not enough pressure for it to happen automatically. My old showerforce one was not setup like this ?

[Dave Plowman (News)]

IIRC, they are two pumps in one - a lift pump followed by a force pump. Positive head ones are just force pumps.

[Dave Liquorice]

It could be if you loft is well insulated but really I see that warning as arse covering. Remove the loft insulation under and immediately adjacent to the pump and construct a box to fit over it that you can insulate or make from insulation board of some sort. It might be worth having some holes top and bottom of the box to allow ventilation and heat from the pump out, try running it for 20 mins with the cover on and see if it gets "too hot".

Have you turned the water supplies back on? Does that model of pump have built in flow switches? You may have an air lock does water flow out of the shower head or appear at the mixer connections under gravity.

[Peter Parry]

That sounds very much as if you have got the inlet and outlet pipe connections the wrong way around. There is a one way valve in the pump on both hot and cold.

[Bob Minchin]

The loft warning is needed as loft insulation to modern (extreme?) specs could well mean the pump will freeze up. If you old one did not freeze and you have not added insulation to your loft since, then it is unlikely that the new one will freeze. Bob

[sbb]

Thanks all for you advice, someone who has fitted a few has also advised me to suck on the shower head as the has had to do that many times to get them working initially. If I can get it going, I will make sure there is no insulation under the unit and try to construct something around it also to protect it come winter.

Ironically the water pressure with the old pump broken was fine and I was not sure weather to bypass the bump and just use flow under gravity but tho id go this way just to have a more powerful shower. Wish id gone the other way now.

[sbb]

Got it working by taking the shower head off and sucking on it to siphoning the water thru. Now just have to get over the paranoia of it being in the loft ;)

Thanks again all.

[gunsmith]

That should do for now, but how difficult would it be to relocate it to the airing cupboard?

[John]

In article , sbb writes

Why not remove any insulation from under the pump, build a box over it and put loft insulation over the top of the box - the pump will then be warmed from the ceiling below?