Safety Tempered glass = "toughened"?

[Tim Watts]

While I'm looking at all the glass, does the kitemark and wordss in the bottom right of the glass here:

"Safety Tempered"

mean what I understand by "Toughened Glass" - ie Building Regs compliant for < 800mm off the floor and the stuff that breaks into cubes?

Old doors - just want to address any issues as I have kids...

The front door (even older) has a lower and an upper pane of plain glass

- damn sure that's not toughened. But with that I could mitigate by fitting a pretty (relatively) decorative wire mesh over the inside.

Or reglaze it - in which case it would be a perfect candidate for a panel of that new Pilkington vacuum double glazing as it will be the only single glazing left in the house...

You might think I'm fussing - but we had a nasty case of another kid in the village feel through some annealed glass (greenhouse type thin to be fair) but got a VERY bad cut up arm. Did not occur to me to check but now I have, it would be sensible to remedy or mitigate...

[Bob H]

Get laminated glass, as its safer and stronger, as in less likely to get smashed.

[Huge]

It isn't fussing. My mother fell through some secondary double glazing on the French windows in our living room (not fitted by me, I might add) which turned out to be plain glass. Fortunately she went through backwards, so just needed some stitches in her bum. If she'd fallen through forwards with her arms outstretched I shudder to think what might have happened.

I replaced all of the secondary glazing.

[JimK]

snip

or get some of that clear self adhesive safety film that you can stick to inner face to "turn it into" laminated styley while you get a tuit?

Cheers Jim K

[Tim Watts]

Ow.

Can anyone confirm if Safety Tempered glass = "toughened"?

That means my side doors are OK :)

Just the front door to worry about.

[Nightjar]

Annealed glass 8mm thick is considered to be safety glass, meeting the building regulations, provided no dimension exceeds 1.1m, which will apply to most two panel doors.

Toughened glass is more resistant to impact than laminated, although laminated won't shatter into thousands of pieces when it does break. It also needs to be mounted properly to get the full benefit of the lamination.

[Tim Watts]

Reasonable idea. However I am tempted by Pilkington Spacia (the vacuum DG stuff). Because it would be a drop in replacement (6mm total thickness, plane a bit of the glazing bars) and would upgrade an old door thermally.

I assume it is available with toughened glass but not laminated - going up to Tunbridge Wells Glassworks to see about my ali window gaskets so I will ask them.

[Andy Burns]

My parents' house originally had patterned, non-safety glass in the double doors between the lounge and dining room - while being chased, my brother slammed one of them onto my outstretched arm - luckily straight through without a scratch, they were replaced by plywood soon after ...

[Tim Watts]

Thanks Colin - I did not know that...

I am not certain how thick mine are. Seem to be rather less than 8mm though. It's true the panels are > Get laminated glass, as its safer and stronger, as in less likely to get

True - but I'm happy with toughened - also the vacuum DG stuff will prob be available toughened but not laminated.

If I need to replace, I might as well get 2 wins for the effort :)

[Fredxxx]

Are there any BS numbers / kite marks on the glass?

[John Rumm]

It was my understanding that this is correct - you heat and then cool the glass so as to create internal stresses in the glass. The stress makes the skin tougher, and when broken, the release of the stresses gives you that typical cubic shattering.

(you can often see the stresses in the glass when looking at it with a polarising filter)

[Bob H]

I suppose both types have their pros and cons. When I worked for a well known Double Glazing Company, I was shown how easy it was to break a toughened glass pane. That is why we have laminated panes on the outside, and toughened panes on the inside of our doors etc.

[The Natural Philosopher]

I would go to a glazier and explain what you have and ask for something compliant with latest regs. No, I don't think you are fussing AT ALL.

Building regs are - apart from eco and disability tampering - very very sane attempts to get good safety and building practice instilled. It only takes on mistake and kids are scarred for life.

[Nightjar]

If you know how. Once I watched a Policeman try to break the side window of a car (at the request of the owner, whose keys were clearly visible, locked inside). After he had taken a few abortive but enthusiastic swings at it with his truncheon, I suggested he hit it with the end of the truncheon near one corner, where there was little give in the glass. It broke immediately. I didn't want to demonstrate how to get in with a bit of plastic strapping with him standing there :-)

Properly mounted, laminated is good for burglar resistance. It is made from annealed glass, although the plastic layer does give it about double the impact resistance of the same thickness of plain annealed glass and makes it difficult to break right through. Toughened, OTOH, has up to five times the impact resistance of the same thickness of annealed glass, but shatters when it does go.

[Tim Watts]

I totally agree - I try to move towards BR compliant even if I don't

*have* to, if there's a good safety case (like this).

However, the biggest problem around here seems to be finding a glazier at all.

All I've found are uPVC jockeys with very little expertise in anything else.

[Tim Watts]

Not that I can see - it is patterned glass so hard to see, but nothing like I found on the side door DG units.

[Tim Watts]

Thanks John - that's good. Those door pass then :)

I forgot that (brain flushed out right now). I will get the kids to put on the cinema 3D specs and see if they can see anything funky :)

[Tim Watts]

In some ways, I prefer "easy to break" as it means better/quicker entry by firemen or exit by us if the door jams or someone's locked the mortice (we try not to do that when in).

Automatic centre punches are supposed to be rather effective!

Burglars don't tend to break windows (unless very small and single glazed) as it makes too much noise.

If the zombie hordes really want in, not a lot will stop them:

[Tim Watts]

:)

The burglars around here usually grab a garden spade and just lever the whole opening light out!

[Brian Gaff]

Knowing what I know now about the criminally inclined. I would never again go for a bottom pane of glass in a door even if its obscured. If you go away the build up of junk mail on the mat inside gives the game away to any druggy with half a brain that you are not at home. Brian