Safety question

[PoP]

I wonder what others would consider doing regarding the following?

I've been asked to re-site a large 3Kw heater in a high street shop. No problem with doing that, quite comfortable with what that entails.

However high up on the wall (at about head height) above where the heater is going are a couple of large reels of bubble wrap plastic which are used for packaging purposes (we are talking here of reels which are a couple of feet diameter by 3 feet wide), so the bubble wrap could easily be unwound to cover the heater. And if the bubble wrap did unwrap to cover the heater then it would instantly present a very serious fire risk, combined with noxious fumes as the plastic smoulders.

There's also the issue that regardless of the bubble wrap unwinding, the 3Kw of heat being pumped out from the heater will rise into the plastic bubblewrap just above, which might well set it alight.

I've told the shopkeeper about my concern, but he reckons it'll be fine because they aren't going to unwrap the bubble wrap to cover the heater. I'm still feeling hot and sweaty about this though.

I'm wondering about the following options:

1) Refuse to resite the heater. 2) Resite the heater and formally warn the shopkeeper in writing of the concern. 3) Resite the heater and have a quiet word with HSE or the local fire brigade to let them deal with it. 4) Resite the heater but don't wire it up. That's not actually so much a problem because the issue at the moment is that the position of the heater is very inconvenient - and moving it is going to solve a problem.

Any thoughts?

BTW, I have made a decision about what I'm going to do, but I'd like to get thoughts from others to see whether they think the same way I do ;)

PoP

[BigWallop]

The heater casing will probably have a warning notice somewhere, telling you not to cover it, so I'd think if it is in danger of being covered, then I wouldn't site the heater there.

Maybe not set alight to it, but it will surely melt it, I'd think.

My opinion also.

No, because the shopkeeper is not the safety barrier here. They only want heat and are not really thinking to much about their own safety. You are, and it should be your decision on the safest place to site such a large heating appliance. Try giving some suggestions on an alternative position for it.

You're the installer, and the way the authorities will look at it is, it is your job, you deal with the consequences of doing it wrong.

Try looking for other positions where the heater can be the most effective at giving the customer what they want. Remember, heat rises, so the appliance doesn't have to be on the walls. If it was fitted above a door to form a heat curtain, then it will probably be more effective at keeping the heat in when the door is opened. Under a counter area blowing heat on the feet if the shopkeeper is standing there all day is another option.

Just a few suggestions sir, but I personally wouldn't site a large heating appliance in a position which I know could lead to problems.

Good Luck with it.

[Andy Hall]

Obviously the safe option, depending on whether or not you want the work. The problem is, that once you go down this path, it becomes possible to see potential problems through Darwinism in virtually anything you do.

I think that I would probably do that - putting a short but to the point letter in with the invoice and sending with special delivery. Also stick at least two "DO NOT COVER" notices to it.

I don't think it is really up to you to do that, and does seem a bit naughty when you have done the job and in effect have created the hazard.

There doesn't seem much point, but maybe it does have value. The trouble is that if you did this and somebody did wire it up, how would you prove that you didn't in the event of there being a problem?

Do tell soon.......

.andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

[PoP]

Sorry, that was naughty of me, but I've been looking at different options, I thought I might have missed one or two others and didn't want to focus people's thoughts on what I had decided.

There are two different problems to contend with in this case. The current heater location is causing an obstruction to a new shop layout, so it has to be moved. The other issue is to reinstall the heater somewhere else.

I'm inclined towards removing the heater from its current position, but not reinstalling it at the desired new location. Not quite sure how to explain this yet as this suggests leaving a heater lying on the floor for people to trip over (in a manner of speaking).

PoP

[Roger Mills]

Applying a bit of lateral thinking here . . .

Is it not possible to re-site the rolls of bubble wrap so that they don't compromise the new heater position?

Roger

[N. Thornton]

Hi

I'm thinking no-one with scruples would knowingly install something that might set fire to a shop full of people, so I'll skip any moral arguments and go straight to self concern.

If you do a piece of work that is dangerous, you may have to face the music (fill in the details of that here). It is on you to assess if there is a risk, and if there is, as you say there is, to go ahead is to walk into the lions' den and hope, knowing how wrong things could go.

I think one would have to be desperate to get involved. I'd certainly say no, and might also comment that they're unlikely to find an electrician that would do it.

Regards, NT

[BillR]

Yes, this does beg the question if the shop was being re-laid out why wasn't it planned properly so there wouldn't be this conflict?

[Andy Hall]

Here's another idea. Why not dump the existing heater and propose installation of an alternative type - e.g. oil filled, which do not have the same hazard issue.....

.andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

[PoP]

It's possible that I don't have enough experience of these oil filled jobbies - my wife and I got one of those cheapo oil filled electric radiators when we first got married, and it was pants. Got hot alright, but its ability to convect air was minimal - might have done okay in an enclosed space like a small greenhouse, but not for a good sized room.

Are other types of oil filled radiators better? Guess they are or you wouldn't be suggesting it!

PoP

[Christian McArdle]

The flat panel ones are awful. The finned types that look like old school radiators are much better.

Christian.

[PoP]

That figures - more surface area to conduct the heat.

PoP