Re: NIC EIC needed to work in the kitchen?

[Appin]

The message

from "js.b1" contains these words:

We're talking about the notorious South African townships where whites don't generally go. Police presence, where it exists, is in a secure compound with a masive flagpole. I can hardly see some official inspecting whether there's some daisychain of powerstrips! These huts frequently have second hand corrugated iron on the roof with the old holes still open to the elements!

Generally there is. The CUs are generally good quality.

The electrical deficiencies are the least of the problems in these places!

There's little to burn

I really don't fancy my whole house "wired" in loose extension cables plugged into the Consumer Unit.

[Appin]

The message

from Owain contains these words:

Quite. AIDS is the major (indirect) cause of death and a very large proprotion of the populaton is HIV positive.

[Tim W]

Appin wibbled on Friday 27 November 2009 19:49

I'm living like that right now - it's a PITA. Can't imagine doing it as a way of life.

[js.b1]

That is good news, really is :-)

Pity it does not solve water, sanitation and AIDS. Any highly virulent flu virus will take Africa apart re combination of Genetics, AIDS & essentially no healthcare. It may not be H1N1, nor H5N1-HP since H1N1 first has been shown to give "survival" in pigs & monkeys - but it will happen.

Loose extension cables only work on a per-room basis - on diagonally- opposed sockets, makes central turn-off easy.

[Owain]

Worldwide, life expectancy ranges from 84.36 years in Macau to 31.99 years in Swaziland which has the highest HIV infection rate in the world (26% of all adults; more in other reports). 61% of all deaths in the country were caused by HIV/AIDS

Owain

[Andrew Gabriel]

AFAICT, there have been no electrocutions from BC pins. Couldn't even find any records of injuries. That makes it (rightly) hard to justify the expense of any change.

That's more than can be said for ES lampholders, where in most countries, the screw terminal can be live, and there are recorded electrocutions as a result of coming into contact with the metal cap on the bulb whilst still in contact with the fitting (probably one hand on the live bulb cap and the other on earthed lampholder).

[Dave Liquorice]

Please Sir, Sir!

My first belt from the mains was from a BC light fitting that I was "exploring" at about age 7. I guess by "electrocution" you mean death rather than just a belt though.

Didn't tell any one at the time, no need I'd learnt my lesson and I didn't want a telling off as well. B-)

[Andrew Gabriel]

My response to the government consultation is still online at

doubt the Government's original consultation paper still exists online though.)

In Section 2.2, I predicted an increase in injuries/fatalities resulting from Part P. I must admit, I didn't imagine it would be as big as it was.

However, Part P was never about safety in the first place. That was just a smoke screen. The ODPM admitted later that they used the wrong figures and over-estimated fatalities.

[Andrew Gabriel]

Somewhere else (New Zealand? I can't recall) had similar rules and got rid of them just after we did Part P, and saw their death rate from electrical installations plummet as people then started fixing old/broken installations.

It emphasised the point that people die from _not_ doing electrical work that should be done, and not from actually doing it.

ODPM wrote to all councils telling them they aren't allowed to charge extra for electrical building notices as they started to do. Some have ignored that instruction. Some unofficially tell people not to make an application to avoid the situation.

[John Rumm]

I think Tony is referring to Australia where he is now...

Out of curiosity, how do they prevent DIY electrics in Aus?

[Frank Erskine]

Me too.

Actually it was an angle batten lampholder on the wall of a sort of lean-to greenhouse at the back of the Edwardian terraced town-house. It wasn't really that it was a BC lampholder; it was attached to a damp wall and the belt was from the wall rather than the lampholder.

Electrocution _was_ always death, but modern parlance seems to dictate otherwise.

Likewise - however I did voluntarily rewire the circuit. A couple of years later my bricklayer uncle (Bob!) completely rebuilt the place as an extension ("annexe") and I helped him wire it, extending the lighting circuit from a looped-in circuit in the kitchen, and a 'power' circuit for a "Harrison" fridge - at around 10 years old.

AFAIK the house never blew up.

And I'm still here (just). After an early youth-hood of wiring a string of MES batten lampholders (Woolworths, 4d a go) in series with bare wire, the ends poked into a 5A socket,

[Tony Bryer]

Yes

No doubt it happens, and Bunnings - our local equivalent of B&Q - sells electrical stuff. Haven't heard these myself but "In fact, in NSW (and probably other states), at the very moment there are radio commercials saying how dangerous it is to attempt your own electrical repairs. It was these commercials which in part prompted this feature. The same commercials, incidentally, state that one in five "handymen" do exactly that. Naughty, naughty."

[Tony Bryer]

"... But [in Australia] even the very best quality unlicenced work can never be "legal".

Now, if you were across the pond in New Zealand, such actions are quite legal. In fact, in New Zealand you can not only change a power outlet or light fitting, you can add additional power outlets, even rewire your entire home if you want to right back to (but not including) the switchboard. The NZ power authorities actually publish information to help the do-it-yourselfer do it him (or her) self.

If you don?t believe us, have a look at

or ."

[Tim W]

Tony Bryer wibbled on Saturday 28 November 2009 02:41

What I can never understand is why politicians' form a long queue to roll in the same turd even though they can see the ones at the front saying "ow, smelly".

If NZ really has got the data showing their approach works better, the rest of us should just say - well, we were wrong...

Oz, Blighty and the Kiwis are culturally similar enough to make this a reasonable assumption.

[Stuart Noble]

How surprising is that. Why does the govt interfere with things it knows nothing about? Lord Mandy's file sharing "crackdown" will be the next comedy show

[js.b1]

I think the best demonstration of gov't is 2 acts...

1 - Ex SAS officer releases actual MP Expense data 2 - Official later release of MP Expense data has everything incriminating blacked out

It is the latter which is much more devastating than the former. It shows institutionalised corruption - indeed I believe Paxman on one Newsnight long ago said the legacy (of new labour) appears to be the institutionalising of corruption.

Electrical wholesalers in Aus will not sell parts to non-card-carrying people, however amusingly I believe they will now sell plugs and will tell you how to fit them correctly. The "Dead Baby" incident may not be on a corrupt lobbyist industry's conscience, but it is on quite a few sparks & wholesalers from importing oddball clipsal stuff (20A plug n socket are quite handy off 20A radials to multiple BS1363/A sockets).

[dennis]

That will just result in less money being spent on music. The figures show that people who fileshare spend about £70 on music while those that don't fileshare spend less than £50 on average.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Don't remember too many from other parties objecting? You can blame Labour for many things. The scandal of MPs' expenses - not. As I've said before, MPs shouldn't be entitled to better treatment in

*any* way than the rest of the country. The IR would simply not have allowed many of their expenses to anyone else.

I'll give one clear example. If you work so late that public transport is no longer available and your employer supplies transport to your home, that is a taxable benefit. Not so for MPs.

[Fredxx]

I'm surprised you say that, I thought transport to and from work when working unsociable hours and there is no public transport running was the one thing that employers were allowed to pay for. When did that change?

[Dave Plowman (News)]

It applied over 15 years ago and to the best of my knowledge hasn't changed. Although some firms might absorb the cost to the employee.

You don't pay the full cost of the 'benefit'. The actual cost is added to your salary and that is taxed in the normal way.