Re: Dishwasher not spraying

[David Micklem]

> I'm having a problem with an old Servis "Secret" dishwasher (also sold

> > under a load of different brands - its a 4-place-setting slide-out > > top-loading grey box....). For some reason it no longer directs water > > through the spray arm. > > > > The water supply and drain pump are both OK (it fills, empties and > > refills a sump area at the bottom at the start of the cycle). The > > spray arm isn't blocked and turns freely. Not sure if the heater > > element is working or not but I'm not sure that would be relevent > > anyway - don't they usually do at least one spray with cold water? > > > > Before I start dismantling it to try and find out how it works/what is > > broken does anyone have any experience with this machine or any > > suggestions for likely faults. Does anyone know whether the spray arms > > rely on a dedicated pump (which could be broken?) or use the same pump > > as for draining (which works)? It can't be a problem with wires passing > > through the door, because no wires pass through the door! > > > > Thanks for your help > > > > David > > > > Is there a humming sound when the water should be spraying? > > could be the main wash pump has seized, and yes they are usually different > form the outlet pump.

Thanks Ian,

Didn't notice any humming. But there is a faint hissing sound - a little like the sound a kettle makes when it is just thinking about coming to the boil. At this stage there is water in the sump area (covering the heating element) but it isn't noticably hot. I'll try going through the program again to listen for humming - one problem is I'm not 100% sure at which 'clicks' through the cycle it normally starts to spray.

If it is the pump, are these widely/affordably available?

David

[David Micklem]

To follow up on this, there _is_ a very faint hum at the same time. I'll try and get at the pump and see if it is OK.

David

[Shrek]

The faint hum is indicative of a motor problem, probably the main pump. the kettle sound is probably the water heating up, you wouldn't notice this normally as the water is spraying around the cabinet making more noise.

the problem isn't so much cost, it is getting hold of one and disassembling the machine to replace it.

-- Ian Tilley Ex-Kirklees Domestic Engineers

's free

[David Micklem]

noise.

disassembling

Your diagnosis was spot on - the rotor (stator? bit that should go round, anyway) on the main pump motor doesn't turn easily/at all. It was suprisingly easy to get at - the whole bottom of the machine could be taken off by removing a handful of screws. I'm not so sure how the motor itself is attached to the main body of the machine though.

I assume that once siezed the motor isn't fixable so I'll need to replace it? Is it normal to replace the whole motor/pump assembly or should I be trying to separate the pump section from the motor (which looks like it may be possible with a few screws)? I guess that the motor is more likely to be available off the shelf than the particular plastic moulding shape of the pump section.

Any suggestions for where I might find a suitable motor (or pump/motor assembly)?

Thanks for your help with this (and sorry for so many questions!)

David

[Shrek]

You could try and lubricate the bearings, but TBH it will soon go again, probably because there is a slight leak in the seal. You could usually see an indication of this with a little trail of salt residue from the seal to the bottom of the rotor.

will have to contact them to order it as it isn't a common part

-- Ian Tilley Ex-Kirklees Domestic Engineers

's free

[Andrew Gabriel]

I've had exactly this with a Creda in-cupboard dishwasher. I bought a new motor/pump (single unit) and it did it again within a few months. You can just about get to the water impeller through the hole under the filter, if you push dinner fork prongs in, which enables you to turn it just enough to free it, and then it runs the cycle OK. Come to think of it, it hasn't stuck for many months now, so the new pump seems to have recovered.

The old one failed because the water seal started leaking and water ran along the driveshaft into the motor's ball bearing, which has gone rusty.

[David Micklem]

Thanks Andrew. I hope the replacement (assuming I can get one) won't have the same problem yours had. I know that the Servis machine I have is sold badged by others (incl Elica and I think Creda). Does yours look like a grey plastic tank with a lid (and very simple controls) on the top? Just trying to work out if its the same thing... then at least I'd know whether the fork trick has any chance!

Having managed to remove the pump completely, and since I have to wait until tomorrow to ring around possible suppliers for a replacement, I decided to at least test it. The rotor is NOT completely stuck, but there is a resistance to turning. When I wired it up, the motor does turn but rather slowly (maybe 30-60rpm). I assume its supposed to be much faster than this but I had also assumed that it would either stall completely or spin at its normal speed so I'm not really sure. I can't see any clear evidence of a leak in the water seal either.

David

[BillR]

When I replaced the pump assembly in my Ariston a 4 years ago the part was £85. To be quite honest the machine really wasn't worth it.

[Andrew Gabriel]

No -- That sounds like a completely different dishwasher I know -- a homark which was sold by B&Q a few years ago, and my father also bought one in France somewhere at the same time. The whole diswasher slides in and out of the cupboard on rails. You can either leave the cupboard door as it was, or remove the door from the kitchen unit and fix it to the front of the dishwasher so that it pulls the dishwasher out for loading/unloading when you go to open the cupboard.

The creda looks more like a conventional dishwasher, but has no outer casing. It is designed to fit very snugly inside a standard kitchen unit rather than in place of a standard kitchen unit, but has a regular door without provision for fitting a matching kitchen unit door. Hotpoint sold the same dishwasher too. I can't check the model as it's in a different house, but something like DXX500 or DXX501 rings a vague bell ('X' = can't remember).

I don't know in that one.

I wonder if it's also damaged the motor? If it's an induction motor, it will normally get up to speed if it can start, as it has low torque when stalled.

[David Micklem]

Thats the one.

It is an induction motor (at least it has a large capacitor attached). Its all rather academic now anyway - I have found a source for a replacement pump, but its around 75 quid. At that price I'll be better off looking for a second hand slimline dishwasher (which I have just enough space for).

Cheers,

David