R.I.P - Potterton Kingfisher RS50 - you've been a good friend

Well I've been here 19 years now and the old girl was here when I bought the place so quite how old she is I don't know but I think she's gasping her last breaths. A tiny trickle of water on the bathroom floor a few days ago has gradually turned into a considerable puddle and much hissing and steaming whenever she's switched on as water leaks into the gas burner part and then out onto the floor. Can't see anything much externally with the covers removed and the pipework seems fine so I think the cast iron boiler has cracked or rusted through underneath. When she's switched off the leak stops too so it's probably a crack that opens up when it gets hot.

She's had two thermocouples in 19 years, never been serviced and not another thing has ever gone wrong. Probably because there's bugger all inside her to go wrong. Oh, tell a lie. I had to fit a new rubber tap washer to the steam vent valve a couple of years ago. My friendly local Plumb Centre couldn't be bothered to write out an invoice for it so they gave me two in case I needed a spare and said hang on to your money.

Looking at horror stories on here and in other places with modern boilers breaking down - printed circuit boards, fans etc I can't see there being a cat in hell's chance of getting that sort of reliability from anything modern. Not that I'm bothered about the long term because I'm selling the house as soon as humanly possible so the cheaper the fix the better. If I could find a replacement boiler section I bet she'd go another 20 plus years.

I hate combi's because I like baths rather than showers and can't be doing with a bath taking ten minutes to run. The house is a small 3 bed semi and the rated output of the RS50 is between 9 and 13 kW depending on the gas pressure according to the sticker inside it but nothing to say what the actual gas pressure is. I suppose something wall mounted would take up less space though.

If she'll last me through the cold weather I might even be so tight as to pull her apart and see if the crack can be welded but if not what's a good replacement boiler?

What's all this Corgi nonsense these days? Can you install a new boiler yourself and get some eejit with a certificate to check it over or have you got to pay vast sums of money for someone else to do it all? If you do it yourself how would anyone know in future?

-- Dave Baker

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Dave Baker
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Is the heat exchanger the type made up of sections held together with threaded rod? If so the 'O' rings between the sections have failed. Stripping, cleaning up the mating faces and new 'O' rings should do it - a simple matter to one of your skills.

Did this on my RS80 some 10 years ago and it's still going strong. You might also have to replace some of the fire box linings due to water damage. And of course all the various rope seals.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Have you tried here .

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it's the heat exchanger they can cost about £300 tho'

Stuart

Reply to
Stuart

Hmmm. It's just a big cast iron box with a side cover at each side held on by 6 nuts. Could those nuts be on rods which go all the way from left to right perchance? I've never had cause to look inside the covers. They've got big rubber gaskets on them a bit like the ones on the cam follower side plates on MGB engines if that means anything to you. Methinks checking to see if those side plate nuts are tight might be a good idea before I do anything else.

Are those things still easily available and if so who from? From Potterton or can you get pattern parts for boilers like you can for cars? The rope seal between the burner and the box has certainly gone on the left hand side. It's wet and bulging out from the join now so the leak must be on that side somewhere.

-- Dave Baker

Reply to
Dave Baker

Thanks Stuart. That's a handy link.

-- Dave Baker

Reply to
Dave Baker

If It's anything like my old CF60 Kingfisher parts are available from Interparts .The Heat Exchanger has two plates one per side held on by nuts threaded on to rods that fit in to the heat exchanger body and do not go right through to the other side and the seals are a pair of rubber like gaskets .I also used some heat resistant silcone I got from Screwfix to help the seal. On mine the gaskets had hardened over the years and just crumbled away so I scraped the residue away and rubbed down the mating faces . I also replaced the ceramic rope but iirc it is £17 a metre .

Stuart

Reply to
Stuart

Nope. Looking at the parts diagram on that link Stuart gave it's just a big open box with side plates. I see what you mean though on the RS80 diagram. On mine either it's a side plate leaking or the box itself is holed. Can't see any other possibilities unless there's things inside the box that the diagram doesn't go into but I'll certainly look at those side plates when I've got time to drain her down. If it's just the left hand one of those leaking I'll be well chuffed. There's certainly a bit of water around that area.

Even if the box is holed it may well be fixable. Mill the bottom off the bugger, cut a slab off an old Ford Pinto engine block, bolt the two back together with lots of countersunk capheads and high temp sealant or get them red hot and nickel fill them. Bob's your aunty :) Probably be a good idea to bore out the gas burner jets while I'm at it, do a bit of porting and polishing inside and wind the gas pressure up to full. Or there's that old DCOE that I've been trying to find a use for, hmmmmm. More power, ugh ugh ugh. (Not quite sure how you spell that thing Tim Taylor does on tooltime - lol)

Thank god it didn't go in the middle of the really cold weather though. I reckon now I can struggle on with the gas fire in the lounge and maybe just run the boiler for hot water once a day until I've got time to look into it more.

-- Dave Baker

Reply to
Dave Baker

Quick look on Google and 12mm fire rope as per the Potterton parts listing - £2 per metre here

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't the internet wunerful :)

-- Dave Baker

Reply to
Dave Baker

Ah - it's different from mine which is older. On mine the threaded rods run externally through eyes in the castings. The end sections are one type of casting, and the centre sections (two in my case) different from them but identical to one another. So a modular unit that can be sized for different applications. I assume. ;-)

I had no problem then getting the fire box liners and O rings from my local Potterton agent. The rope seals are 'generic' and any PM should have them - you just cut to length.

There's a boiler 'breakers' near me. Perhaps you have a local one too? They might be able to sell you a secondhand heat exchanger for pennies if indeed yours has rotted through - although I'd say this is unlikely. But I've never use them - the only other thing mine has had is a couple of thermocouples.

But with rising gas prices it will probably be worth changing it for a more efficient model. My gas bill is now about 1000 quid a year - although it is a large Victorian house with solid walls and we like it comfortable. ;-)

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

I'd definitely guess at leaking seals before cracks or corrosion.

;-)

And a GT badge and stripes for the casing?

Is it on a solid floor? Otherwise I'd be concerned about where the leaking water could be going to.

It's how the mighty have fallen, isn't it? A company who once made boilers which can run for 20 years (mine nearer 30) with little attention now make ones which can barely do a year without expensive repairs. That's progress

- in this throwaway world.

Of course fools like dribble will start bleating on about the higher efficiency brought about through the use of electronics etc. But then the same applies to car engines - and they're more efficient *and* more reliable than 20 years ago - in general.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

And it will still be a 20+ year old boiler. Spending £600 on the cheapest new boiler will probably be a better short term investment as a modernised heating system will be more attractive to buyers.

Owain

Reply to
Owain

If you are "competent" you can DIY from the point of view of gas regulations. However, DIY would have to have a Building Regulations Application to the council.

The boiler's installation book usually has to be signed and stamped by a CORGI commissioning the system for the boiler's warranty to be valid - if you are selling soon it's likely that the buyer's solr will want sight of both the Building Regs compliance document (from the CORGI or Council) and the boiler warranty.

Owain

Reply to
Owain

Aye. Bathroom's downstairs and a concrete floor so nowt to get damaged. Saves having to put a water bowl down too cos the cat and ferret can drink from the pool round the boiler. There's always a silver lining if you look hard enough :)

-- Dave Baker

Reply to
Dave Baker

Is that 600 quid *installed* for a modern equivalent of an RS50? And some figures on the likely maintenance costs of a cheap boiler?

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

You must have harder cats in your part of the world. Mine demands nothing short of Perrier. The ferret just drinks out of the bog. Knows its place.

But if you've got plenty of inhibitor in the water at least they won't rust.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

I don't know if it's the equivalent, but £300 for a new heat exchanger is plus the labour of stripping down and reassembling. Might well be quicker and cheaper to pull old boiler off wall and put new boiler on wall. Depends a lot on flue, condensate drain etc of course.

Who cares about maintainance costs? The OP said he was intending to move fairly soon. Surveyor will see that boiler is shiny new and has a warranty. Surveyor won't know/care which is a cheap or which is a good boiler.

Owain

Reply to
Owain

But Dave Baker is perfectly capable of changing/repairing the heat exchanger himself once he knows what the likely fault is. It's simple mechanics on these boilers.

Surveyor will probably comment on the age of the rest of the system. And even with a new boiler recommend the whole lot is professionally checked.

Then there's the installer of the new boiler requiring a power flush etc.

I'd say you simply won't get back the cost of fitting a new boiler reflected in the sale price. Better to just fix the existing one for pennies - if you can DIY.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

The Boiler Choice FAQ was written for more or less your situation. Please Read.

Reply to
Ed Sirett

-- Dave Baker

Reply to
Dave Baker

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