Programmable TRVs

[GMM]

Tim Watts' post about CH controls provoked me to think about this again, but in a sufficiently different way to justify a new thread.

I don't really want to be able to control everything from the moon or have some self optimising system (they can't even get a word processor to learn effectively). Rather, I'd just like to control some rooms independently of the whole system without going around the house opening and closing valves twice a day. I know I could/should zone the system but that will have to wait for some glorious future date.

Initially, it would seem most useful to be able to stop the living and dining rooms heating in the mornings when, at least during the week, they're never used. If it has any impact, I could take it further through the house.

So two questions:

Has anyone done this and had good or bad experiences? (I'm aware they can be noisy but they would be operating mostly when there's nobody in the room.)

What is a cost-effective solution? I can see Pegler i30 valves at various prices, down to the low 20-quid mark but some less branded alternatives have prices way below this (eg at 30 quid delivered for 3:

.

Although I can't help thinking that if it's too good to be true, it probably is, I have 5 radiators between just these two rooms (19 in the whole house), so costs mount pretty quickly.

Any alternative suggestions chaps?

[Tim Watts]

Do you want programmable TRVs or RF controlled with the schedule done centrally?

[Graham.]

It seems to me that programmable TRVs on individual rads are the ultimate zoning system.

[GMM]

Well, while the latter sound attractive, when I costed them a while ago, I was looking at something north of a grand for the house, so it's probably not the extra, unless things have changed significantly in the apst year or so.

I reckon individually programmable would at least give me a start to see how things go.

[Bill Taylor]

I've just installed a few of these

and some of these and one of these

They will work independently, but the wall thermostat makes it easier to set a program if you have 2 or more radiators valves, and the cube makes the whole system much easier to set up.

So far it seems to be working OK, but It's only been running for a couple of weeks!

The TRVs seem a bit flimsy and plasticky, and can be noisy in operation and there is no boiler control option.

The advantage is that the wireless protocol has been deciphered and then it's possible to integrate a cube based system into other control systems to add functionality.

See

[Tim Watts]

Danfoss do the only half decent ZWave TRV and that's £51

You could control that with a Fibaro HC-Lite internet ZWave controller or even a regular computer with a ZWave USB stick.

Or even Danfoss's own controller.

The interstign thing about the Danfoss valves is they are part of the Heat Genius system, so in theory you could run them dumb with a cheap DIY Zwave controller and then upgrade later to a super smart self learning system by adding the HeatGenius hub.

[R D S]

I fitted something similar to our rads but the valves are each controlled individually from remote timers placed more conveniently/effectively.

Worked out at about £50 per rad but the house is infinitely more comfortable even if we never get the money back (though i'm sure we will if we haven't already, we seem to be using much less gas).

[Andy Burns]

Don't think I'd want an extra 19 sets of batteries to have to run round and replace ...

[Graham.]

Apropos to another recent thread; maybe the Building Regs should make a POE CAT5 mandatory at every radiator location.

[Andy Burns]

Maybe the smartTRVs could use heat from the system to charge a supercap with a thermopile?

[Bob Eager]

I was waiting for someone to suggest a small windmill on each radiator.

[Andy Burns]

I saw the 'opposite' the other day

could make sense, but not at that price

[harryagain]

The expense of this sort of stuff makes it simply not worth it. Far better to invest in insulation, (which also has an unlimited maintenance free life).

[Chris J Dixon]

I have a couple of these

(The "Radio Exhaust" is actually a radiator bleeding device, and this combination is currently £13 cheaper than one without the freebie)

They have worked well so far. The actuator has a small motor inside, but seems to be pretty economical on batteries. I believe the remote sensing is a big improvement.

Chris

[Dave Liquorice]

They are just the (cheap) electronic control heads, no (expensive) brassware.

Looking at those images, won't the display be upside down when veritcally fitted to a valve and the high side to the wall? Same for the other Conrad eQ-3 MAX! heads.

[Scion]

Dave Liquorice put finger to keyboard:

Yeah - there's a review of one of them that says this. Conrad are a German company and apparently the continentals tend to use horizontal or vertical TRVs at the top end of the rad. I'm surprised the system isn't designed so the display can be rotated - the one in the picture has the display in English after all, so they've catered for the UK market in that way.

[Alan Braggins]

I did wonder whether the setup on

was standard for France. (Stella Z-wave, not the Conrad, but it's "horizontal at top end of the rad".)

[CB]

I bought 4 of the Pelger i30 at the start of last winter on an offer similar to this

(4 for £75)

1 and a half winters is not enough to comment on effect of bills, but rooms are now heated only when required so there must be some saving.

Very pleased with ease of installation, not had to change batteries yet and although initially quite noisy this noise level has reduced considerably with use.

[Capitol]

The very thought, fills me with dread. I make that 48 settings a year that you have to change, on just 4 radiators (BST/GMT). For my 15 radiators this becomes 180 settings a year to change. Then I'd need 15 sets of batteries and as we're away for periods of time, I'd have to change the batteries twice a year, or fit 15 wallwarts in very inconvenient places. Seems like an application looking for a use to me.

[RJH]

I think if you have a fairly predictable routine, they could work. For me, though, it'd be horrendous. Much easier to switch them up/down as required.

Also, so far as I can see, they won't 'call' the boiler to heat a room. So if the system is off from the central stat, they won't be much use.