The thing is that the soft solder discussion has been introduced by others my discussion was about what we and the makers, suppliers Australian users call silver solder
The first on this page
Nothing at all to do with my discussion except the high melting point one
I think you have comprehension problems I am not talking about any form of solder that melts at low temperature with or without lead silver etc You keep bringing that up I am talking about a form of soldering or brazing normally called in australia and if the truth were known in the UK by the term silver soldering in which you need a temperature above red to achieve.
May be the problem is word meanings in different countries It makes no difference to the fact that plumbers extensively use the first silver solder on this list in Australia.
It seem that maybee the UK does not which seem strange to me as this method is the most permanent and safest. If I had joints in concrete or walls or floors or anywhere inaccessible I would much rather them silver soldered with (copper silver phosphor alloy)(melting point red)than any form of soft solder
If you call that silver solder, what do you call real silver solder with a silver content of approx 40%?
Help us here. What is the melting point of the solders used in Australia?
Bullion, unless you're Rod, then bullshit.
Almost never...
Lead free soft solder is specified in the water regulations for potable supplies.
Compression is still acceptable for water and gas.
Various makes of push fit for water only
Some emergency of crimping systems as well.
Can't think of any advantages, and plenty of disadvantages in its use for this application. When copper pipes fail, it is almost never due to solder failing in the fitting.
Probably part of the closed shop mentality that still seems to pervade Aus attitudes... it used to be the same here in the '70s - there are some that would like to go back there as well!
We understand what you mean (i.e. what we would call brazing or hard soldering), but were just highlighting that for plumbing, lead free soft solder is the norm here.
It depends, in the case of soft solders they will melt with a soldering iron or small flame, in the case of the silver solders I have been talking about the pipe has to be red hot If you want the actual temperatures it is easy to look up although with the silver solders I have been talking about sometimes called silver brazing solders, the temps vary as they have many compositions some with very high amounts of silver. The plumbers mainly use the low silver content ones 2% 5%
When I was handymaning I came across many failings of soft solder in brick walls, usually in the bathrooms never with silver soldered joints
Silver solder or if you prefer, 40% Silver solder.
You may know what I mean and most others may know . but one did not or this discussion would not be going on.
You should try it sometimes.
As Richard posted with details above above, it is quite quite clear that hard soldering / brazing is commonly used in Auz. Mr Murtz also made it quite clear in his OP that he was referring to a brazing alloy
You seem to be missing the point that UK silver solder contains about 40% silver - and its use isn't restricted to jointing copper.
With a joint that was as strong as the tube, freezing would likely split the tube. With soft solder, it may just 'pop' the joint making repairs easier.
Seems like you don't know how to solder.
Not sure why you would consider soft solder any less permanent... I can't see any advantage for water applications (although I could see an argument for gas pipes as the braze will survive longer in a fire).
With a pipe in concrete, its the copper that is likely to fail unless adequate protected from the concrete. The solder is a non issue since its only in contact with the internal surfaces of the joint.
In areas with aggressive soft* water we will use / specify DZR (DeZincification Resistant) pipe fittings, but for use with the same soft solders as normal.
Probably more to do with what is perceived as "normal" there rather than any (obviously dodgy by definition) foreign method.
Ah. An architect with a bee in his bonnet. How unusual. ;-)
On 18/07/2014 10:34, F Murtz wrote: ...
It also requires a lot more heat, often in difficult to reach places, which, to me, suggests a much higher fire risk.
It is not a problem at normal water pressures and I prefer solder to compression fittings.
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