OT - Virus troubles (Mydoom)

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Witchy wrote:

Er, no, thety were not. The very first Internet worm was created for and succesfully brought down just about every VAX on the net.

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wrote:

Yes, but how many more were there?
-- cheers,
witchy/binarydinosaurs
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Witchy wrote:

A few IIRC. But in those days you had to have access to a vax to build one, and few vax admins were of the script kiddy psychology.
Its not JUST the vulnerabiity of PC's thatmakes them such tempting targets, its beacsue any asshole can buy one and download a D-I-Y virus kit from the net

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No, only every VAX running UNIX. Which was far from every one. The VAX commonly ran *either* UNIX (4.xBSD) or VMS - both were not affected.
--
Bob Eager
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Bob Eager wrote:

Are you sure? You may well be right. Umm. You are. I don't think there wer many VMS machines on the net then - in fact I am damned sure there weren't because DEC didn't have a TCP/IP stack for them - I used to be involved selling third part VMS TCP/IP some while before that worm appeared.
So there is the definitive answer. No viruses on VMS because it couldn't be (Inter) networked. DecNet was not an internet protocol..
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wrote:

Wollongong.... FTP Software..... I wonder what ever happened to them....

.andy
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Andy Hall wrote:

Yepo. All those. Also TGV and Fusion.
The lads from FTP software...mm. They are doing someting still. Can't remember waht. Try www.ftp.com

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wrote:

TGV I remember, but not Fusion. IIRC, Cisco bought TGV and it disappeared.

I believe that the Israeli company, Netmanage, bought them.

.andy
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It was Ultrix, which as you say is a 4.x BSD variant.
-- cheers,
witchy/binarydinosaurs
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wrote:

Well, the VAX ran vanilla 4.xBSD too. I used a VAX-11/780 running BSD 4.0/4.1/4.2 etc, direct from Berkeley. A lot cheaper than buying Ultrix from DEC (that came later, anyway).
--
Bob Eager
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This is not necessarily true: worms can be written with multiple payloads and platform detection code. In fact, the Morris Jr worm wot we're reminiscing about did exactly that: it worked against sendmail implementations regardless of instruction architecture (as its exploit was at the Sendmail application level - switching on Debug mode to elevate privilege, and then assuming it could talk Bourne shell), but also had specific binary exploits against VAX-running-BSD and Sparc-running-BSD-I-Think - from memory (and since this stuff happened before The Web it's not the work of moments to find the info) it was a fingerd buffer overflow. ISTR that it tried to run the VAX-specific arm under VMS, and got nowhere, as young Robert didn't have one of those to test against when doing his pure intellectual curiosity exercise ;-)
Stefek
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wrote:

But Linux is a multiuser system and its kernel and device drivers are protected from users... so what's the difference?
--
Bob Eager
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Bob Eager wrote:

None. As long as programs like Sendmail run with superuser privileges, they can be compromised.
The real difference is the Linux servers are put togeher by people with a little konwledge of how computers work and are harder to program vuirses for for the average script kid. That makes themn a harder target than a PC or NT server.

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wrote:

Ta - that's what I was going to say :)
-- cheers,
witchy/binarydinosaurs
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Witchy wrote:

My point being that you don't need to fiddle with the OS to catch a virus.
No compuyter can run entirely in ROM that has any sophistication - it needs at least data variables and probably a stack. That means some form of writeable memory.
If it is to run programs at all it needs to load them off a disk or flash memory, both of which can be corrupted.

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NOT WIV ME!!
mike r
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They will never be successful until they find a way to provide enough drivers for all the hardware out there.
Martin.
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I don't actually hate Linux, I got it working a bit, and online after buying an external modem....
Did you come across this...?
If Linux was a car...Sense of Humor required!
M: Hey Pete, Can you help me put a radio in my Debian? P: You're an Idiot, RTFM!
M: I need more help than that. P: You're an idiot! I did a Google search. It's in the page referenced by the footnote in the 37th hit. If I could find it, so can you.
GS: (Good Samaritan) you need to rebuild the engine to add a radio. M: Rebuild the engine? P: You're an idiot!
GS: There's a how-to. It's written for a "Hat", but it's mostly correct except that engine is in the rear. It's translated from German, but they did a pretty good job. It'll tell you to hook the radio to the red and black wires, but since you've got a Debian, there won't be any red and black wires. And you still need to write the radio driver. Don't forget to regrind the camshaft. If you don't, you'll get an error message that you don't have permission to change the tire pressure, but it's the camshaft. You'll need a lot of tools, but you can get them for free. Most of them come with instructions... about 900 pages in all. Read 'em all carefully and understand 'em before you start. Should be able to figure it all out in a couple of months.
[MUCH LATER...]
M: Hey Pete, I didn't get all the stuff I needed to rebuild my engine. Can I borrow your Drake again? P: The wife has the Drake, but you can borrow the Hat.
M: This is different. Where's the steering wheel? P: That dashboard was really using a lot of gas. This has what is called a CLI. Just type CTRL-L to go left and CTRL-R to go right.
M: What about the gas and brakes? P: That's all combined into a single speed number. Just type ps | grep speed. The headings are in Klingon, but the third number is the one you want. Just divide by the speed of light to get meters/second. You'll have to parse it out, calculate the new speed and use the nice function to change the priority of the process. That changes the speed. If you had just read the manpage, I wouldn't have had to tell you all that.
M: Which manpage?.... never mind... What if I need to stop in a hurry? P: Gotcha covered. There's a script for panic stops. Just type "PanicStop-3.8.63278665-HAT when=now". It will ask you for a password. Enter the password and hang on cause you're gonna stop real quick. I'm really proud of the deceleration optimization routine. Be careful typing, it's case sensitive. If it gives you a cryptic error message and doesn't stop, it's probably because you forgot to add yourself to the brakes group. It's all in the manpage.
M: Which manpage?.... never mind...
[MUCH, MUCH LATER....]
M: I wish I hadn't sold my Gates. At least I could drive it to town and pick up Granny.... P: You're an idiot!.....
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Did you write that all by yourself?
--
geoff

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No, if I was clever enough for that, I could work linux!
mike r
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