OT - tax disc holder

[Bob Henson]

On 06/10/2014 8:58 AM, "Nightjar

[Chris French]

Yes, I know, but that doesn't mean the system being used in a post office for the tax renewal does that checking.

As I said our PO was changed last year, from a normal PO counter at the back of the shop to a counter right next to the shop tills. (on the whole a good thing IMO) As part of this they installed a new system to deal with the transactions, maybe this does the MOT but those in older PO's don't?

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[Tim Watts]

I don't think ANPR is involved with catching VED evaders - as you must either have VED or SORN the vehicle, any vehicle that is un-SORNed and has no current VED is guilty - it does not have to "be caught on the public road" like the old days...

[Andy Burns]

THough ANPR will catch those who have declared SORN, but use the car on the roads anyway, which amounts to evading VED.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Not at all true. I can search a database of 2.5 million postcodes in a tenth of a second here.

on a crap PC.

On decent database and hardware its infinitely faster. Once you have a time/gps/number plate triple, its trivial to do a search to identify anomalies.

just don't tell anyone.

Now it would appear there

[F]

I watched a programme recently that showed a foreign registered HGV being pulled over and having its tachograph checked after ANPR cameras had logged it in two different locations that it could not have been in if the driver/time regulations had been adhered to. The check didn't appear to be anything other than auto-generated.

[Tim Watts]

That is true -

[Bob Henson]

But if there are no checks done by the camera operators, anyone with a genuine number plate on a "wrong" car will get away with it - on or off the road.

[Bob Henson]

With the number of cars on the road, are you sure they'll bother to continuously monitor every car, 24 hours a day, every day of the week, and get someone to check and action the results? The computer can be set to follow certain criteria as to whether or not the car could have been in the places the cameras say on the same day or at the same time. Many people will have to be employed to check the results and action them - you can't just hurl court summonses at people because they apparently drove a long way in a day according to an arbitrary computer algorithm. Well, you could, but they won't. There aren't even any cameras round here anyway - if you stay off the motorway, they'd probably never find you anyway.

[whisky-dave]

I doubt that's what's meant.

I thought they were only looking for lorry drivers driving for too long or too far, I don;t think car drivers have a legalm restriction.

They'll check their figures if tehy are suspoious, then they'll recheck hopefully.

Yes cameras aren;t everywhere and niether are cars and lorries. A patrol car might pick up a driver on a local road or if it's involved in an accident.

[Tim Watts]

I agree.

First thing you do is sort the triples by

Number:time

Then you process those in sets of each number-plate looking for unrealistic time deltas given the 2 GPS points as the crow flies.

All pairs that fail a crow-flies speed test would definitely fail in reality as the actual route will be longer most of the time so the average speed needed to achieve the time delta will be even higher.

If you are worried you might be missing some naughty people, and you want to be really clever, you multiply the "as the crow flies" distance by a factor (say 0.5) to get a first sweep candidate list. Many of these will actually be innocent.

Then you run those through routing software to see if they'd fail even when using "the fastest road route between the 2 points".

The latter is computationally expensive but it would be operating on a fairly small list.

The former computation is cheap as chips as TNP suggests.

Then you get to decide if the anomaly is due to speeding or cloned plates.

[Tim Watts]

How will ANPR pick that up?

[Bob Henson]

It won't - that's what I was saying.

[The Natural Philosopher]

you wont do that. Not worth it. Only investigate the really stoopid one like a car being in London one minute and Bradford the next. You KNOW summats up with that!

[Bob Henson]

Absolutely - but only if anyone notices, and I'm not sure that's very likely.

[dennis]

Its the same technology as average speed cameras, you know the fastest between two cameras so you can flag any that are too quick.

Also given that its almost impossible to get between two cities without being ANPRed yo know that if two cars are seen in none adjacent areas something is up.

If people actually knew how many cameras there are they would fit revolving plates. 8-)

[bert]

And SORN your own vehicle.

[bert]

I think that's a big difference. Under the new system the casual observer whether traffic warden or joe public will not be able to spot untaxed cars.

[bert]

Wouldn't it be easier to check VIN

[bert]

But for the average motorist going about their normal business how frequently would they be clocked by an ANPR?

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