OT - Sound Card for Dell Dimension E521

[Wesley]

Apologies for being off-topic but I do intend to fit a sound card myself and I have been amazed at the wealth of knowledge on this NG in the past.

I am trying to set up my PC so that I can use it as a multi-track recorder for composing/playing music using Audacity software. Mostly guitar and vocals.

On my first attempt to add a second track to a recording, I found that the two tracks do not sync - the sound on the second track was about one second behind the first track. A friend has suggested that the reason for this is that I do not have a dedicated sound card. The sound on my PC is integrated into the motherboard.

My questions are:

1. Is this the reason for the delay? If I fit a sound card, will the problem be solved?

1. If I do fit a sound card then what type? I did some searching and it all seems to be very complicated. For example is it a PCI or ISA interface? Are the bit rates and max sample rates important and do different rates affect how they will work on my PC? Would I need to upgrade the power supply? Is there anything else I should take into account?

These are the specs for my PC -

a.. AMD X2 3800 (2.00GHz, 2x512K) 1 491.17 491.17 b.. 1GB Dual Channel DDR2 533MHz [2x512MB] Memory c.. 250GB 7200rpm SATA Hard Drive d.. 256MB NVIDIA GeForce 7300 Turbocache (1xDVI, 1xVGA, 1xS-Video) e.. Audio Software Integrated Sound Blaster Audigy Advanced HD f.. Windows XP Media Centre SP3

Thanks in advance for your help J

[David Paste]

For getting pretty reasonable sound into my computer, I use this:

acts as sound-out. Phono & digital connections. Much better quality than the built-in sound circuitry in my laptop - less noise, etc.

As for the delay in sound, audacity makes it easy to get rid of the delay - you can move the sound around. Just google the user manual for audacity, it's pretty helpful, and easy enough for a newb to grasp (a la moi)

Cheers.

[John Williamson]

The reason is latency. It takes time to process the analogue signal into digital and vice versa. It happens with all sound cards. The latency can be altered with the right driver, and in some cases can be reduced to the equivalent of a couple of inches change in distance from source to microphone.

Once you have the tracks recorded, you can line them up for playback in Audacity by selecting one of them and moving it along the timeline, it seems fiddly but can be done easily with practice, and when you learn how, it can be made sample accurate by typing the amount of the move into a dialogue box. The method is in the manual.

How many channels do you want to record at a time? You can get USB sound interfaces which will do two or four channels at once, or you can install a firewire card and get an interface which will cope with 16 channels. I've got a Lexicon Omega which will record 2 microphones and 2 line inputs at a time, while playing back a stereo mix from up half a dozen tracks, dependiing on effects, and also has a DI input. Latency on a 1.6GHz twin core laptop can be as low as 15 milliseconds.

Or, depending how fussy you are about sound quality, you could use a standalone recorder like the small Bose pocket studio. Then copy the tracks onto your PC using USB or an SD card reader and use Audacity to tidy it all up.

What is your motherboard, and do you have firewire built in?

[Bill]

The standard answer to this is to fit a soundcard that uses asio drivers. These bypass the native Windows drivers and allow you to set the latency to usable limits. The "soundcard" can be PCI or external using usb or firewire.

However, I don't believe that Audacity natively uses asio.

Reaper and Wavosaur both will work with asio and both can be used for no payment, although Reaper will nag.

The other approach is to use a soundcard that has direct input monitoring. With this, if you sing into the card with headphones on you don't hear yourself in the past.

If you want to record just guitar and vocals, something like the Tascam US-144 is ideal. There are loads of these devices, and the choice depends on how many inputs you actually need and the sort of connectors you want it to use. Incidentally, I've been testing a few of these and would suggest looking for something in a metal case for screening and that uses USB2 rather than usb 1.1, especially if you have an AMD processor which may have an ATI chipset. ATI have a "usb filter" that is difficult to find on their site and that is necessary with USB 1.1 audio interfaces.

[Bill]

Sorry to follow up my own post, but I've only just noticed the mention of XP Media Center Edition. I remember people having difficulty with audio on this peculiarly crippled version of XP Pro, and have dug out a reference to a rather old forum post about potential problems. I'm afraid it is rather heavy going and depressing, but worth knowing about. If buying a soundcard, maybe make sure it is returnable if it doesn't work?

expand on the usb soundcards list, I've successfully used units from Edirol (aka Cakewalk), Tascam, M-Audio and E-Mu, which is the more professional and far superior end of the Creative Soundblaster empire. I have used Soundblaster usb devices, but had problems with them.

I do a bit of multitracking with guitar and some vocal, with the guitars being acoustic through a mic or plugged in. The key features are the direct monitoring and, if you ever might use a condenser microphone, whether the unit supplies phantom power.

I also use a firewire device occasionally, but firewire seems to be on the decline and it can be difficult to set up to be reliable..

[Wesley]

For getting pretty reasonable sound into my computer, I use this:

acts as sound-out. Phono & digital connections. Much better quality than the built-in sound circuitry in my laptop - less noise, etc.

Would this act as a pre-amp for an electric guitar to increase the line in signal or would I need another device as well?

[Wesley]

I am just experimenting with sound recording at the moment and don't want to spend a great deal initially. Even a single line in through a soundcard would be sufficient at the moment.

[Wesley]

Thanks for a lot of very useful information :-)

[David Paste]

Ah well, I honestly couldn't tell you - I don't know what the level output of an electric guitar is. The same company do this unit:

seems to be specifically for guitars, so you could give that a go. Perhaps if you rang a local music shop, they would be more clued up - the place I got the Behringer unit from:

you could do worse than asking them.

Cheers.

[John Williamson]

Try:-

to connect a guitar pickup direct to a computer.

The UCA 202 has line level inputs and outputs only. You may be able to use both units at the same time, but driver and software support will be patchy. You may be able to plug your guitar into the 202, but the impedance and levels will probably be well away from the optimum.

Another way to connect a guitar is with a DI box using a microphone input on a mixer.

[John Williamson]

That limits you to PCI express cards, PCI based solutions, which are mostly fairly long in the tooth and need you to open the case, or USB. PCI Express solutions also need you to open the case. You can get a PCI firewire card, and if you choose the right one, you can get excellent performace with the right soundcard. The firewire chipsets are all of limited compatibility with each other, though the problems and solutions are well documented.

Try the cheap (About 20 quid) USB interface from Maplin. It accepts line level inputs from a mixer, and outputs the same levels. To record from a microphone, you will either need a better sound interface or an external mixer. Maplin do mixers with pre-amps and line inputs starting at about

50 quid.