OT How to live forever

[geoff]

In message , ARW writes

Looks like Russ Andrews has a new sideline

[polygonum]

The DWP would freak out...

[Phil L]

Not really, they'd just increase retirement age from 65 to 590

[polygonum]

And pay ESA for an *lot* of years?

[Andy Champ]

I noticed the middle on on the top row. Apricot kernels. Don't they contain Cyanide?, I thought to myself, and googled for vitamin B17.

"Since the early 1950s, a modified form of amygdalin has been promoted under the names laetrile and "Vitamin B17" as a cancer cure. In reality, neither amygdalin nor any derivative such as laetrile is in any sense a vitamin. Studies have found such compounds to be dangerously toxic as well as being clinically ineffective in the treatment of cancer. Taken by mouth they are potentially lethal because certain enzymes (in particular, glucosidases that occur in the gut and in various kinds of seeds, edible or inedible) act on them to produce cyanide. The promotion of laetrile to treat cancer has been described in the medical literature as a canonical example of quackery, and as "the slickest, most sophisticated, and certainly the most remunerative cancer quack promotion in medical history."

Andy

[polygonum]

Lugol's solution - which has been used to *** suppress *** thyroid activity in people with Graves (hyperthyroidism). And iodine is often regarded as a positively bad thing to take in most cases of hypothyroidism (except where actually caused by low iodine).

Magnesium oil which is not oil. Merely because magnesium chloride has a somewhat oily feel.

Noni juice which seems a very expensive way of buying sugar (albeit fructose).

Lots of very questionable products.

[Dave Liquorice]

ICBA to visit the site but silver *is* an antibiotic.

guess this lot are hanging far too much on the wrong hook on the basis that the Great Unwashed with too much money are also too thick to do basic backround research.

[Frank Erskine]

As good a reason as any to eschew apricots - awful things.

Pineapples too, and gropefruit, which I'm fortunately supposed to avoid :-)

[Dave Liquorice]

Context? Colloidal silver certainly hasn't been proven to have any real medical benefits but other silver compounds have and are used.

Copper or brass is cheaper...

Maybe they ought to install these:

you'd want them as bare metal, before the lacquer has been applied... Then I expect people would complain about the patina that would develope, or the shock risk (the fact that everywhere these days has CPC wouldn't be relevant). But it is seemingly silly simple things like using brass light switches that could reduce cross infection rates. If a bug lasts 6 hrs on a plastic switch and only 3 on a brass one...

[John Rumm]

This is one of the dichotomies of a number of "alternative" treatments - many are valueless in clinical terms, and yet they do achieve real benefits for some patients in situations where conventional medicine seems to fail them. Perhaps it really comes down to having someone take a genuine interest in your problem, and not treating you as a crank, and then secondly, the patient actually believing that the treatment will have a positive benefit. The placebo effect is real and demonstrable.

[geoff]

Are you missing the point that silver is an antibiotic whose efficacy was known in roman times, even if they didn't usually have light switches

[polygonum]

The context was the link to wiki on the post I responded to.

[polygonum]

The pattern I so often see (in the particular things with which I am familiar), is this. People try a new treatment and sometimes seem to get some benefit, say how wonderful they are feeling a bit better. After a while they stop mentioning it. Later still, they are asked how it is going and "admit" that they have given it up either because it was not working, the side-effects were too much, or whatever else.

Unfortunately, standard medicine has a number of products which cannot simply be given up and require a very long, slow process of tapering off them in order not to cause big problems.

Fortunately, there is a considerable range of things which could be classed as safe (or fairly safe) to try out for oneself and which might have positive effects. Provided they are used with sufficient research, care and thought, I'd include vitamin B12, apple cider vinegar, selenium, dietary exclusions, vitamin D. At the same time, some things often regarded as fairly innocuous can be quite dangerous - iron-based supplements (unless you have demonstrable iron-deficiency), folates (unless you have demonstrable B12 sufficiency).

Some of these allow many cycles of trying to DIY fix yourself - with little real danger. (Perhaps the biggest issue is missing out on timely diagnoses and treatments rather than the things themselves.) And, inasmuch as placebo works when DIY, then that effect too.

And some of these things DO work.

[meow2222]

There's really nothing wrong with eating fruits that release cyanide, as long as the amount eaten is within safe limits. Apricots, almonds etc are quite safe to eat. All ingestible substances are toxic in sufficient excess, even water.

NT

[alan]

Much like many of the Amazon reviews. The 5 star reviews are from the people who received the product the day before and still believe the manufactures claims. The 1 star reviews are from people who have been using the product for a few weeks.

[polygonum]

Amazing how many Amazon reviews do indeed say things like "Arrived. Box looks bigger/smaller than expected. Brilliant product. Have not yet opened or used it."

[polygonum]

Cyanide can be mopped up by sufficient vitamin B12 if supplied as hyrdroxocobalamin or, I think, methlycobalamin.

But which water? "Natural" water? Reverse-osmosified water? Rain water? Hard water? Soft water? Fluoridated water/non-fluoridated? Chlorine-free?

Be careful out there - you could drown in all the waters.

[Dave Liquorice]

Any of them, too much fluid intake is as bad as too little.

[John Rumm]

People confusing Amazon reviews with ebay feedback...

[meow2222]

around 1000x more of a fatality risk apparently

NT