My brother got a phone call the other day asking for his wife by her name. Caller had a local accent. Passed the call over, and it turned out to be a someone selling something. Did a 1471, and got their own number. Did a call back, and of course got engaged. How does this happen?
CLI spoofing, more common on calls routed via the cheaper/dodgier providers, especially VoIP providers.
As Andy said, CLI spoofing, but it begs the question, why do it on a marketing call? I take it this was a landline, if it was a mobile (1471 works on 02 IIRC) then there could be an altogether more sinister reason for the call, let me know if that was the case.
Presumably because most people would never put their own number into a blocklist ?
No. I am convinced this goes to the heart of the voicemail hacking scandal, but our networks have yet to issue the appropriate advice.
When you retrieve your voicemail using your actual mobile handset are you asked for a PIN? No? Well in that case anyone calling your mobile number and presenting your mobile number as their CLI will get straight into your mailbox providing only that the call would have gone to voicemail anyway (busy, switched off, no signal).
Let me be clear about this, instead of hearing, "This is Jethro, please leave a message", they will hear, "You have 5 messages, to listen to your messages press 1"
I know this to be true because I sometimes spoof my mobile number on a VoIP line (so people will ring me back on my mobile)
The VoIP service I use requires me to prove I have access to the mobile by me entering a PIN sent by text into a web form before the CLI is usable, other providers around the world may not be so fussy.
It all mostly runs on "trust". (and the occasional signed contract).
So the wholesaler I use trusts that I'll be doing the right thing and present the numbers I have correctly, or present my clients numbers correctly when I can prove that the numbers belong to the clients...
BT (and other operators) then trust my wholesaler and pass-on the CLI.
Some operators don't trust incoming CID from abroad, some do - so my brither in Germany calls me on my BT landline and I get "INTERNATIONAL", but if he calls me on my mobile or VoIP number then I see his caller number 49.....
If the calling company in the OP post is a UK company, using a UK provider then they really ought to be doing the right thing - I'm sure that if their provider gets to know about it, then they'll put a stop to it...
But who knows how often they check on things like that...
Gordon
People are much more likely to answer it if a real number is presented rather than "Unavailable" or "Withheld". If I get a text message sent to the landline then the CLI presented is my own number.
was the case.
Am I missing something? The OP said that the number was *engaged* - not
*unobtainable*. Chances are that the phone was genuinely in use - cold-calling other people!
But surely, by definition calling your *own* number should result in "engaged".
That said, I am sure when I was a kid, I tried dialling our own number, and got "unobtainable". Maybe the older (strowger) exchanges couldn't resolve the number ?
Try dialling your own number (As shown on the OP's 1471 trace) from your own phone and see what you get. I get engaged, not unobtainable. I suppose it's not worth programming the exchange to say "You've just phoned yourself, you idiot!"
snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk...
that was the case.
Most likely reason is that the telemarketeers are on a loop server or whatever it is clled designed to thwart the income tax people and for the callers themselves who are quite often working and claiming the dole.
messagenews: snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk...
was the case.
That may or may not be the case, however the more compelling reason for presenting a real number is to sidestep all those who have elected to have anonymous caller reject turned on.
Presenting a local number is probably even more effective than a national or non geo number for telemarketers.
The downside of presenting a real number is of course that then gives the called party a chance to start back tracking who called them - find out who owns the number block etc and work back from that. So by spoofing the number of the person they called they block that line of redress before its even started! (in which case your best bet it to probably fake interest in whatever they are selling for long enough to elicit some details of who is calling)
I've always got "number withheld".
I suggest you google it; there are a couple of sites that collect these numbers.
Andy
Yes and that's an absolute pain for us. We are signed up to the telephone preference service and now get no more than one marketing call from within the UK every couple of months. We do however get a number that just come up "International" and we can't avoid answering them, as we do receive legitimate calls (credit cards, etc. and family and friends). I would be much happier if they *did* put the CLI through (trusted or not) and let us take our own decisions!
SteveW
I wonder how intelligent these exchanges are? What would happen if I redirected our number to my parents', my parents' to my uncle's and my uncle's to our number?
SteveW
messagenews: snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk...
that was the case.
presenting a real number is to sidestep all those who have
non geo number for telemarketers.
called party a chance to start back tracking who called
spoofing the number of the person they called they
bet it to probably fake interest in whatever they are
Thus engaging in a dialogue with the caller who would otherwise have been given short shrift. In a word, psychology.
If this theory is right, I wonder what reason is given for presenting the targets number?
In the days of strowger kit and local, usually 2 digit, short codes for adjacent exchanges you could ring yourself.
Dial a local code for an adjacent area, and then another local code and so on via a large number of exchanges and eventually coming back to your own. Dial your own number and then put the phone down. The phone rings and you pick iy up and there is no one there.
This only worked, so I was told at the time, if the engineers had left that enabled for testing (which I think they did, by and large). So it meant you could call long distance at local rates if you knew the local code from each hop to the next. E.g 9697 got you from Crawley to Brighton via Horsham (or something). I recall calling my bro in Hatfield from Crawley that way. But we both had to shout because I think you bypassed the amplification.
But they soon got wise to that and disabled it. You could still use 96 to get Crawley -> Horsham but I think a further local code got you NU.
Yes, sorry - I misinterpreted "got their own number" to refer to the cold-caller's actual number rather than the called number.
In message , The Other Mike writes
Nothing clever about that - happens every day.
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