New regs for who can fit gas boilers??

[Lobster]

I have a plumber who works for me on occasions, doing work which has included fitting gas boilers. This guy is now actually retired after a lifetime's plumbing, therefore doesn't have a CORGI ticket; so I have had the gas installations CORGI'd subsequently in order to remain properly above board.

So far so good; but today he tells me that he won't be able to fit any more boilers now due to new rules coming in in the new year. This is the first I've heard of this, can anyone enlighten me? He reckons that when you buy a new boiler after January, you'll need to sign your life away or something, and provide full details of who'll be fitting it etc etc; evidently he's been frightened off by this. He also told me about Part P (electrical) in the same breath, which I knew about, but which makes me think his source may be reliable.

Can anybody tell me more about this? I'm hoping to be able to convince my plumber friend he's wrong!

Thanks David

[Jyestyn]

properly above

something,

(electrical) in

convince my

Whilst browsing in the plumbing section of my local B+Q shed this afternoon, I came across a label attatched to a shelf displaying gas boilers. It stated that it is illegal for a gas boiler to be installed by an individual unless he/she is registered with CORGI. Maybe they check the customers corgi card when the boiler is presented at the till. ;-)

[Ed Sirett]

It is not AFAIK illegal due to the Gas Regs provided you are competant.

However heating appliances come under building regs and there will be issues about self certification of compliance v. submitting a building notice.

This is going to be observed in the breach along with part P.

I'm surprised that you semi retired friend doesn't think that

[Mike]

B****y hell. It's only £112 for a Chartered Engineer. I would have thought something under £100 was more in line.

How do bodies such as CORGI justify such exhorbitant fees ?

[Andy Hall]

Because the law allows the HSE to approve a "class of persons" for the purposes of the Gas Safety (Installation and Use) Regulations 1998.

It chooses to appoint CORGI, and only CORGI for this purpose.

If you look on the HSE web site, you will find that there have periodically been objections to this, studies have been done, etc. The outcome has been not to change this.

Therefore CORGI doesn't need to justify its fees within quite a margin of reason.

Put a different way - Why does a dog lick its balls?

[Mike]

But the IEE is the only body to charter electrical/electronic engineers and the people needing the charter could probably afford far more yet aren't ripped off like this.

[Andy Hall]

Yes, but you don't *have* to be an IEE member in order to be an electrical or electronics engineer. I don't know what proportion of jobs in these fields require chartered engineer, but unless it has changed dramatically in the last couple of years, it's not the majority by a long way.

Whether that is the reason that IEE fees are low is hard to say, but it's not really comparing apples with apples when you consider CORGI's pseudo governmental role.

You do have to be a CORGI member in order to legally do gas fitting professionally.

[Andy Luckman (AJL Electronics)]

To take away the taste of the food you insist on providing for it? :-)

[Andy Dingley]

But how many chartered engineers _need_ to be chartered engineers? There's some prestige to it, but almost none of them are required to be so by any mandatory rule.

[Andrew Gabriel]

In my industry (computing), people started getting excited about it in the late 1980's with rumors of EU legislation requiring it for certain things, related to signing products off from a liability perspective IIRC. One or two EU countries (Austria springs to mind) did see significant numbers of engineers going through charter applications, but the whole EU initiative then died before it ever got off the ground. The professional bodies (IoP in my case) still keep pushing it, but no one else seems remotely interested now, at least in my experience.

[Andy Hall]

Institute of Plumbers?

That's for people doing networking and is Microsoft's view of Cisco.

[Andrew Gabriel]

I doubt the Institute of Plumbers is entitled to award chartered status. :-) No, Institute of Physics.

ISTR Institue of Physics used to also award Chartered Engineer status on behalf of IEE before IEE was granted permission to do so itself. I don't know if they would still do that now.

[Mike]

Depends what you are doing - anything legal needs charter for instance. Also it helps in presentations to governments.

But for many other engineering-based professions - especially civil engineering, architecture and so on, it is almost impossible to practice without a charter.

[Andy Hall]

Personally, I prefer to get it right rather than to practice :-)

[Mary Fisher]

That's been the raison d'etre when trying to persuade members of associations to apply for a charter, in my experience.

But when it's been successful it's never worked with governments :-(

Mary

[Mike]

Not here anyway. But in France it is essential to have gone to the right sort of schools to move up the political ladder. We have that here a bit of course (Eton and so on) but these are state schools that choose on ability those likely to be able to lead a country.