New electricity meter - rip-off

[PeterC]

Eon just called and replace my meter with an Ampy 5246C. Just in passing, the chap mentioned that it runs on GMT for Economy 7, so will switch at 0700 when we change the clocks. Means that stuff that I do before 0800 now will be on the higher rate.

The old meter was switched by radio signal and ususally switched at 0803 all year round. Typical that modern technology can't do what the old stuff did - well, it could but... It could have been switched via mains, I'd have thought.

BTW, searching for Ampy 5246C gives no useful hits at all; I wanted to confirm the settings. Did find that it's rated for 20 year life so it might still be here after Smart Meters come out.

Chap also started to replace the fuse - I assumed that it was in case the old one had got tired, but he was putting in an 80A instead of the 100A. He told me that it was due to the board feeding the storage heaters having

16mm tails, so I pointed out that it was 3-way so could take about 42A max and he left the 100A in.

[js.b1]

Re 80A fuse...

- Tail size can force a derating

- Not uncommon to replace 100A by 80A these days

Condition of some networks might not disconnect a 100A fuse due to Ze drift, so the DNO are fitting 80A fuse as a lot cheaper than maintenance which is typically fixed-fee min-bid and repair not replace. Like the daft "dig a road up 50x to replace 50 gas leaks rather than mole a new pipe in once". If you "paid" for a 100A fuse upgrade I'm not sure what they would do, probably check Ze at that point in time.

Re radio teleswitches...

- AFAIK they did not follow summer/wintertime adjustment

- So E7 ended at 7:30am in winter, but became 8:30am in summer re BST

[Dave Liquorice]

And mechnical ones certainly don't and ones with busted clockwork switch at anytime depending on how long the last power cuts were...

[Adam Funk]

I've seen two different versions of E7 meters in different areas, both radio-switched:

1. with the night rate from 01:00 to 08:00 clock time, all year round;
2. with the night rate from 00:30 to 07:30 in the winter and 01:30 to 08:30 in the summer.

No idea why. Item 1 was about 16 years ago, but when I had it installed, it was considered to be better than the mechanical ones that behaved as item 2 still does.

[PeterC]

He said it was done on all new meters fitted.

er, what's Ze drift - OK, off to Yahoo! (that doesn't really work as a verb). Um, nowt showing.

Mine did - could hear the clunk if 'twas quiet here.

[PeterC]

Yep, that's what mine did.

[tim.....]

I had one which the guy set from 22:00 to 24:00 and 02:00 to 07:00

Not only was this better for me for "other" use, it was also better for me for heating the house

tim

[dave]

Earth impedance maybe - just a guess.

[The Wanderer]

The new meter (made by a subsidiary of Landis & Gyr, a highly respected name in the field of metrology and protection) is also controlled by radio tele switching. What's your problem?

Ah, I see. You're moaning because your winter time E7 *might* just be switched at the times published for the E7 tariff. Of course, you won't find this out until the clocks change, so it's not a 'rip off' at all then?

Have you looked at your electricity supplier's web site? Have you asked them what the time periods for E7 are?

[PeterC]

That it's not enabled/addressed. I have a radio-adjusted clock, but I can turn off the receiver (I prefer it to be a bit fast. Just because it's built in doesn't mean that it has to be used by default - there's a lot of that in telephone exchanges.

As usual: 7 hours between 0000 and 0800, so 0700 is implied as possible, not published as definite.

The electrician said that the meters are supplied as GMT only and warned me about being on the higher rate at 0700 in the winter. It's a bit like BT or some [other] ISP changing the times.

[The Wanderer]

How do you know it isn't enabled? Are you basing your comments purely on what the meter basher said? Sorry but he almost certainly *won't* be an electrician, and may well have misled you because he has an incomplete grasp of what he has tried to tell you.

The time periods differ by supplier. This link lists times by all suppliers.

's not particularly up-to-datee, as it lists some now-defunct distribution companies. It does however illustrate quite clearly that E7 is available for a *period* of 7 hours in an wider envelope of 8 or 9 hours, depending on the supplier.

Seems fair enough to me. Also suggests you're getting E7 up till 08.00 now....

No it isn't. You're getting E7 for a seven hour period within the wider time envelope as published by your electricity supplier.

[PeterC]

Thanks for the link. It's changed since we first went on to E7, as then it was 2400 to 0800. My area is E. Midlands, supplied by Southern Electricity through Ebico but the times are the same. What I don't like is the uncertainty - preferred the fixed period (well, been the same for about 10 years).

[Adam Funk]

But you need to know in advance what period you will actually get so you can set the appliance timers properly.

[PeterC]

Yes, that's the point. Storage heaters are OK, of course, but it is useful to know when the rate applies. That 'time envelope' is OK for load management and still supplies the circuit switched by the meter but things like the washing machine...

[Chris J Dixon]

How about looking at the meter display around the possible switchover period?

Chris

[PeterC]

Yes, meant to do that this morning but got distracted. I've a spare outlet for a storage heater so I might stick a mains neon on that as an indicator (easier than getting to the meter). This, of course, tells me only when it has happened, not when it will happen the following day!

[Adam Funk]

Is your supplier actually saying the E7 period can vary from day to day?

[Nick L]

My meter doesn't appear to have any visual indicator as to which way it's switched (unlike my old mechanical one). However it does make a fairly loud clunk when it switches so I've been able to confirm that E7 is going off at 07:00 gmt.

[PeterC]

Yes, it's 7h within a 9h period; it might not have to be continuous.

I saw a bit somewhere that suggested that the meter could be used for load management (I'd guess by turning off storage heaters only), which suggests that there might be some sort of control possible. If that is so, then the time could also be controlled re. BST/GMT.

[PeterC]

Ah, I'll have to listen for that. I'd assumed initially that it might be solid-state switching, but for possibly 60A and not all resistive, that'd need thyristors as big as the meter.

If mine is 0700 (that'd be 0600 on GMT) then I just about got the heating period of the washing machine.

Mine shows "1" for daytime rate and "4" for night-time.