I am having a complete central heating system installed, with a condensing combination boiler, (Ideal HE24), and 6 rads, should the rads and pipework be flushed before firing up the boiler to remove any dust etc. in the pipes? The reason I am asking is that I have been told by the installer that the installation will be completed in one day, and I am concerned that this is not enough time to do the job properly, although the installation is pretty straightforward, and it will be a 'team' doing the work.
Do not have an Ideal boiler at any costs. Look at a Broag 39C. Made by Remeha, a long standing in the UK quality Dutch maker. They use quality standard industry parts: Gianonni heat exchanger, Honeywell hydroblock, Grundfos pump, Dungs gas valve. Weather compensation as standard. OpenTherm control. The system and open vented boilers are "dual temperature" boilers. The best price/performance around. The Dutch have the reputation in this game and make the best boilers. Also look at Atmos. Atmos are quality design and manufacture. My favourite combi and they have OpenTherm control and weather compensation too. If you want to spend more then buy an ATAG - the best.
Install a Maganclean filter on the CH return pipe "this is essential". Have them put de-sludger in the system for ta least 1 day before installation.
This is the problem, it is not at any cost, and the boiler choice is not negotiable :-)
Thanks, but I can't see anything being installed that is not specified, so I don't think I will be seeing a Magnaclean filter, and if they are doing the work in one day, then it is obviously not going to have de-sludger in for one day. I am just trying to make sure that under my circumstances, I get as reliable and as clean a system as possible, but I am not able to dictate to the installers what is fitted, only point out any specific procedures that must be followed according to manufacturers specifications, this is why I want to know if the system *must* be flushed prior to connection to the boiler, and what is acceptable as flushing. Below are the relevant installation instructions from the manual, but it does not make it clear if this is for a new installation, or if they are for a boiler that is to be connected to an existing system which might contain contaminants and could affect the new boiler, as it only mentions existing systems, if you see what I mean.
If water treatment is used Caradon Ideal Limited recommend only the use of FERNOX-COPAL or MB1, GE BETZ SENTINEL X100 or Salamander Corrosion Guard inhibitors and associated water treatment products, which must be used in accordance with the manufacturers' instructions.
Notes.
It is most important that the correct concentration of the water treatment products is maintained in accordance with the manufacturers' instructions.
If the boiler is installed in an existing system any unsuitable additives MUST be removed by thorough cleansing. BS 7593:1992 details the steps necessary to clean a domestic heating system.
In hard water areas, treatment to prevent lime scale may be necessary - however the use of artificially softened water is NOT permitted.
Under no circumstances should the boiler be fired before the system has been thoroughly flushed.
Define "properly". In my book that is with minimal surface pipework and everything replaced/refixed and "made good" ready for decorating. IMHO it's not possible to do that in a day, getting access and putting the pipes in the floor voids could take a day or more.
Are they using copper or plastic pipes. With copper it should be flushed to remove flux residues and swarf. Probably not quite so important with plastic.
Yes. It's usually a condition of the guarantee for the boiler that the system is flushed with something like Sentinel X300 to remove flux and any other debris which can be found in new plumbing fittings. May not be so necessary if system is mostly plastic pipework with no soldering.
Thanks Andrew, and the others that have responded, I think the system is to be installed using all copper pipework so I will make sure that the system is at least flushed, even if the flush cannot be left in the system for 24 hours.
It will be copper pipes. I have done some floorboard preparation to make the job a lot easier for the fitters, so it should be straightforward, giving them enough time to flush the system, providing the flush does not have to remain in the pipes for too long, which was my main concern time wise.
Oh dear, good luck, you may well need a lot of it.
I think our neighbours have things sorted out now but not after a couple of insurance claims for new carpets and a sofa. Electrician fitting the thermostat drilled through one of the new pipes... Pipe runs are mainly surface and it took several installation attempts as the fitters hadn't got the tools to deal with 12" stone walls. Despite this being pointed out the the "surveyor" and each time as the arrived then said they couldn't do it. Oh and the fitters were travelling about 50 miles to the job so arrived gone 0900 and left about 1500.
Well in general and IMHO the fitters used by Warm Front are not the brightest in the box. Any heating firm that is any good will have enough work from their reputation without having to take cut to the bone budget jobs that require them to rush to finish within the timescale allocated.
I suggest getting the installation manual for the boiler (online or swipe it from the box when they arrive) and see what it says about flushing and a new install. Then make sure they stick to those instructions, even if they have to come back the next day or the day after(*). Be prepared to firmly argue your case and don't accept no for an answer. Bear in mind the fitters are effectyievly caught between a rock and hard place, your argument is with their supervisor/Warm Front not them.
(*) If the instructions say the flushing agent should be in the system for
24 hrs filling it at 1700 then washing it out a 0900 the next day is not
24hrs...
Fernox say "When pre-commission cleansing new systems, Fernox Cleaner F3 should be circulated for a minimum of 1 hour at normal operating temperature."
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you shouldn't need a flush in the system for 24 hours. (An old sludged up system is another matter.)
This could be hard to achieve since the installation instructions state that the system must be flushed prior to connection to the boiler, therefore making it impossible to circulate the Fernox for a minimum of 1 hour at normal operating temperatures :-) I think a phone call to Ideal is needed to see what their recommendations are.
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