More on Razor Wire

[Bob Eager]

I wondered if he lived near Alexandra Palace...

[Huge]

It's entirely possible to protect the rights of the law abiding and withdraw them, to a large extent, for law breakers.

[nightjar]

I had to complete a detailed incident report, send a copy of my risk assessment and detail what steps I had taken to prevent a recurrence, for the Health and Safety Executive after someone trespassed on my land, pricked his finger while skip diving and complained to the Police that the skip contained sharp objects. To be fair, both the Police Officer who turned up to inspect the skip and the HSE inspector thought the whole thing a total waste of time, but they had to follow procedures once a report had been lodged. I wouldn't want to do the paperwork if someone cut themselves on razor wire.

Colin Bignell

[nightjar]

Probably only people who have back alleyways to their homes and even that might vary; Around here, an alleyway is a twitten. Like others, I thought you meant aluminium gates.

Colin Bignell

[Martin Pentreath]

Since we're going wildly off-topic I have to say - rubbish! Human rights are in principle rights of the citizen against the state. They exist to stop the state abusing its powerful position against all of us. It's when the state starts accusing you of being a criminal and of breaking state-made laws that human rights are at their most important. To my mind that's the mark of a civilised society. If you want to live somewhere where they torture you when you get on the wrong side of the law and stone you and amputate bits of you when you're convicted I believe parts of the middle east and asia might suit you. You can festoon your house with razor wire there to your heart's content and shoot the little bleeders on sight, ask questions later.

Cheers!

Martin

[Dave Plowman (News)]

I'm not so sure. Tell people criminals have no rights is giving them cart blanch to seek retribution. And that's the law's job, not the individuals. Anything else is the law of the jungle.

[Martin Pentreath]

PS I should just add that in the particular instance we're talking about, the law about keeping your property safe for visitors, including trespassers, has got nothing whatsoever to do with human rights. Most of what the Human Rights Act gets blamed for has nothing to do with the Human Rights Act. The rule we're talking about comes from the principle of occupiers' liability, which predates the Human Rights Act by a long way.

Along with "data protection" and "heath and safety", "human rights" is used as a scapegoat for all sorts of things.

Human Rights regulate relationships between citizen and state, not between private citizens.

End of law lecture.

Cheers!

Martin

[Bob Eager]

Sussex or thereabouts?

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Indeed. My father used to work for a garage and about 50 years ago it was broken into. The burglar or whatever fell down an open inspection pit and broke his leg. The owner was prosecuted. The pit should have been covered up when not actually in use. I dunno under which act the prosecution was brought but it was long before the days of H&S. Which in many ways is designed to protect the employer from prosecution rather than aid the worker.

[Dave Liquorice]

Sorry, wrong plant. Berberis is the right one, there are many variations but some have seriously spiky stems and spikes on the leaves. Not something you would choose to climb over/through.

[Andy Champ]

Am I the only one who thought they were gates to allow their (friends and) allys to enter?

Andy

[Andy Hall]

Often in these kind of circumstances, the fine is a token or reduced amount so that the law is served but justice is as well.

[Andy Champ]

...allies to enter?

Andy

[Andy Hall]

Or Ally gates (which are your friends in times of adversity), or Bill's Moroccan cousin.

[ARWadsworth]

I thought is was a Yorkshire thing. Everyone I asked today knew what a Ally was.

Adam

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Yes - the fine wasn't large, but the cost of having an advocate attend court probably was.

[Frank Erskine]

Chemical Ali?

[Huge]

I am in two minds about this. The law is definitely too far on the side of the burglar at the moment, but even I don't really want lynch mobs roaming the streets looking for dropping sweet wrappers so they can be strung up.

[RobertL]

I believe you can get soft rubber stuff that looks like razor wire: it's a deterrant but carries no risk of injury.

Robert

[Dave Plowman (News)]

It seems to be human nature wanting to enforce laws. But only the laws that individual approves of - and not those which may effect him. Other name for this is religion.