More on electric cars.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

And I'd guess we'll see even more charging sockets as makers go down their own sweet way...

[Dave Liquorice]

Think there is word missing in the end of the last sentance.

But these electric cars aren't designed for driving across europe or any great distance. They are for the wage slaves doing the M-F 9-5 25 mile round trip commute.

[The Natural Philosopher]

and the school run..

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Then they need to match or beat the overall costs of running such a vehicle. Instead of costing considerably more.

[whisky-dave]

So what are the DIY costs and how would one go about installing your own charging point on your property, I'd hate to have a charging lead poked through my letter box out to the street where it'd be a trip hazard ?. I'm just wondering how people will charge these from home and I'm talking about the majority that park on the street or the closest they can which for me would be across the road. Or are electric cars only for people with garages ?.

[dennis]

You just need a waterproof while in use socket, like the masterseal range(1). If you only have on road parking then you will have to find someway of getting the cable to the car without it being a trip hazard. (Maybe some overhead drop across the pavement?). You can get a supply to the edge of the pavement for bus stops so you must be able to get one for a charge point, for a price.

(1) If you have a meter box you may be able to put a socket in there to avoid having a waterproof one.

[John Williamson]

charging point on your property, I'd hate to have a charging lead poked through my letter box out to the street where it'd be a trip hazard ?.

about the majority that park on the street or the closest they can which for me would be across the road. Or are electric cars only for people with garages ?.

The market seems to be well off,green minded people who don't travel much, with enough space to park the vehicle so that the power lead doesn't cross any public land. That's just about all suburbs and no inner cities anywhere except for well off people who live in blocks of flats with their own parking. Which is a shame, because small electric cars would be ideal for inner city dwellers.

Most of that sums me up, except the well off bit. I can afford to run the old petrol car I've owned for over thirty years, but I can't afford the initial cost of even a G-Whiz. Which is a shame, because apart from when I'm working, I generally drive no more than 30 miles a day even on my days off. When I'm working, it's 2.4 miles each way, but I can't carry what I need to carry to and from work on a pushbike.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Quite. It's a city car and vast numbers of UK cities - or at least the inner bits - are old and have little off street parking. And to provide an infrastructure to charge all cars which park in the street is going to cost an absolute fortune. It's just one of the many things that those who love electric cars (without, of course, owning one) haven't thought about. Nor do they seem to realise that if they do become common, any saving in running costs over petrol or diesel will be removed by some form of taxation. They wouldn't be bothering with them if petrol and diesel weren't taxed. ;-)

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Have you ever been in a G-Whiz? Terrifying experience. You loose the small size and convenience of a scooter etc, but feel equally as vulnerable.

[djc]

But the wage slaves are just the people who can only afford one car, so it has to do all the other occasional, but so often vital, trips too.

[djc]

charging point on your property, I'd hate to have a charging lead poked through my letter box out to the street where it'd be a trip hazard ?.

about the majority that park on the street or the closest they can which for me would be across the road. Or are electric cars only for people with garages ?.

Only for people with garages, plus parking space for a second car. And more money than sense.

[djc]

Inner city dwellers ?I am one? don't really need cars, there are buses and taxis, and the necessities of life are largely within walking distance. And these days inner city dwellers are more likely to be young and economically and physically active rather than old and poor, so even less excuse to drive everywhere.

[Dave Liquorice]

So they use some of the money they save from the cheap energy, reduced tax, etc on the day to day electric car to hire a more suitable vehicle as required.

Figures were posted recently about how much one of these cars would save someone communing into central London with, no congestion charge, free parking and charging etc. I forget the numbers but it was several thousand pounds...

[Doctor Drivel]

They are NOT.

[Doctor Drivel]

It does with the Ampera

[Doctor Drivel]

Yep, in cities and towns to clean the places up.

[Doctor Drivel]

Hence the Ampera, which in a town or city charged overnight will rarely need to use the petrol genny engine. It is simple.

[Doctor Drivel]

That is why full EVs are all around London. The level of emissions should be raised to exclude the FIAT of no congestion charges. If an IC engine can nudge in, the bar has to be raised.

[Doctor Drivel]

Cars these day cars just do not need an engine of a large capacity. Four or three cylinder engines are all they need. The days of direct drive by IC engines are nearly over - we are at the beginning of the end. Look at:

petro/hydraulic hybrids which is very promising: detail of the BMW car's testing: from Valentin Tech shatters the way we think about cars: MPG INGOCAR (the hydraulic accumulator is the structure of the car):

[John Williamson]

Hybrids are at least as complex as a normal car for the mechanical bits, with the added complexity of all the electrical equipment and mechanical arrangements to handle the division of drive between the electric and internal combustion motors.

Electric cars are also complex, as they have equipment on them to use regenerative braking, battery charging and motor control. The last simple electric vehicles were the old fashioned trolleybuses with the resistive controllers, and even modern trolleybuses and trams use much more complex stuff than that. Our hybrid buses at work are *much* more difficult to work on than our normal buses.