Machine Mart - small claim

[Rick Hughes]

You might remember I posted details of an item I bought from Machine Mart (combined magnifier & Fl light) it was useless, quality of magnifier lens was so poor everything was out of focus.

Took it back the next day ... as I had 'opened the box' they would only give a Credit Note.

Next time I went to buy (>£50 ) took Credit note to pay ... to be told credit note expired. In the very small print there was a date limit ... certainly not mentioned by the shop at the time.

I tried multiple approaches to MM ... all rejected, so followed suggestions here and submitted a Small Claims Court write ... for value of goods.

Their defence is the terms of credit note were written on it, and they therefore dispute the claim. They have issued a counter claim ... where they are claiming £380 damages for "Transport to and from court, & time away from the office"

[Onetap]

Excellent. I hope you win and am confident you will.

What was written on the credit not is irrelevant, the goods were unfit for purpose, you were entitled to a refund, they only fobbed you off with cred it not because they'd misinformed you.

I don't believe they can claim for any of their costs in the County Court , they're trying to scare you off with the £380 counter claim.

Bunch of low-life con artists.

[ARW]

Why should they not be allowed to claim for any of their costs?

[Andy Burns]

Seems those items are in line with what the court *can* award if you lose

[Bob]

I suggest the OP posts over on uk.legal.moderated where you will get some helpful interesting responses.

[Rick Hughes]

I have done that today ... (following your advice)

[Bob]

I found myself in similar situation a year or so ago, good luck.

IMHO guess they wont show

[Tim Watts]

On Sunday 21 April 2013 19:47 Onetap wrote in uk.d-i-y:

and I'm very pleased to see them named and shamed here.

Wankers...

[Bill]

I've just had a look there and didn't see your posting. I wonder if you mentioned Machine Mart in the posting? The Mod's on there are very twitchy about creating problems by mentioning identifiable entities. They are much more likely to let posts through that don't mention them directly, you are also more likely to get more detailed advice. There are 5 posts awaiting moderation there at the moment.

[Bill]

In message , Bill writes

And no sooner had I posted the above and a Mod' cleared the waiting list and your post appeared, is someone watching uk.diy ?

>

[The Medway Handyman]

I won't be buying from them in future, thats for sure.

[Peter Parry]

they're trying to scare you off with the £380 counter claim.

County courts hear a number of cases and in most costs are awarded against losing parties. However, for cases heard on the small claims track the losing party, if a business, will not usually be awarded costs unless the judge believes the case against them was without merit.

[tony sayer]

In article , Rick Hughes scribeth thus

How very poorly they've handled this, it must have already have cost them and will, by the look of it, cost them even more.

How much better if they just said sorry you weren't happy with your purchase, please bring or send it back and we'll give you a full refund.

Chances are that you'll do business with them again. I would.

and

Some on here now won't bother buying from them!...

They could learn from the likes of John Lewis, excellent service and even Toolstation had very good service there too with something I didn't like the look of when I got it hack home.:)...

[Bob]

moderation queue here

[Bill]

That is where I got my figures from. But it's academic now as the post has appeared. There again it can be an education to see why some have been rejected.

[Dave Baker]

You weren't obliged to accept a credit note but having done so you have waived your rights to compensation or replacement of the original goods. Lack of knowledge of your rights under law is not the court's problem or in fact the seller's. As to the small print on the credit note, again you should have read it carefully first. I'm afraid you therefore don't have a claim against them.

I suggest they may well succeed for reasonable out of pocket costs against you although time away from office is not normally something allowed in the Small Claims track.

I would think carefully about continuing with this. So far all you have lost is the filing fee if you discontinue the claim.

[Dave Liquorice]

What is £5 note but a "credit note" against the Bank of England? They

don't have expiry dates...

The expiry date should have been pointed out by the store at time of issue, giving the OP the choice to accept those terms or decline themand insist on his right to a full refund. The "opened box" is not a reason for the store to not accept the refund, how is the OP to inspect the goods without opening the box? Would they insist on payment for "opened

box" if he had opened the box in store and decided not to buy?

The snag is that it's the OP's word against the stores, no real evidence that he wasn't told of the expiry date. But what would a "reasonable man on the street" think as fair?

[Brian Gaff]

I'd have thought the defence ran like this. You fount it faulty. You returned it for a refund. they refused, but gave a credit now thereby admitting liability for faulty goods. You now require what you should have been given in the first place, the value of the faulty goods. Brian

[Mark]

AFAIK this is not relevant. No T&Cs can override your rights set out in legislation. If the product is faulty and you return it next day they have to give you a refund if requested. There is no obligation to repackage the item(s).

Assumming this is a B2C transaction then the OP will win.

[Dave Liquorice]

I quite agree this "refunds only given with complete undanaged packaing all instructions and accesories" is only so they can take it out back to the shrink wrap machine and put it back on sale. Or send it off to one of the "catalog returns" firms who flog of stuff by the pallet load.

If I take something back these days it probably will have the packaging and instructions (Why do I need 'em...) but will also have a note written inside the instructions that it has been returned faulty and what the fault was.

I've bought stuff in the past that has been faulty and there has been someone elses pencil notes on setup/config in the instructions. Or in the case of a leaky kettle it was still wet inside. Both items where sold "as new" not "customer returns"...