Less than 1 year from cordless drill batteries - home DIYer

[405 TD Estate]

I just wanted to know how long you would expect NiCad batteries to last in a drill that is used maybe 2-3 times per week requiring maybe

1 to 2 charges per week.

The drill has 2 battery packs and both would only last a short time recantly after I owned the drill about a year. I remember reading NiCad batteries should be able to be recharged about 1000 times (which at recharging each pack only once a week is 20 years on my useage)

The drill is a =A335 job from Argos and I'm guessing the batteries are poor quality. luckily they have replaced the drill so i now have a new drill and another years guarantee but i'm wondering if in 1 year the batteries will be shot again (probably).

Should I take it back and get the =A3100 Matika drill + 3 batteries? (not a hammer drill though)

Other than this I am happy with the drill - 2 speed, brake, hammer function (good in everything except concrete) 13mm keyless chuck (difficult to tighten enough sometimes though)

The batteries are chinese made and state 1.5Ah which is quite good really.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

It depends on the quality of both the cells and charger. What kills Ni-Cads *in a pack* is discharging them totally - as the cells will not all be the same and there's the possibility of reverse charging occurring on one or more. But overcharging is what really kills them.

It depends on the charger. If it's a cheap fast charger which doesn't shut down when the battery is charged or cooks them even decent cells won't have a long life.

Not really - over 2 Ah is common with decent quality sub C cells.

It's usually pretty easy to modify a cheap charger into something more sanitary like the standard 1/10th capacity constant current charge rate which means in practice an overnight charge. Or indeed to use a pukka intelligent fast one. But both would invalidate the warranty.

[Peter Scott]

I'd have a go at replacing the cells. Most difficult bit will be prising the pack apart without destroying it. get some two-pack resin glue to put it back together! The maker will almost certainly be using standard sizes to save money. You can get rechargeables of all types, capacities and sizes from companies such as

think that the reason that drill batteries fail quickly, and I've had that experience, is that they are used for a job then put away for a while uncharged. I try to remember to recharge them every month or so if I'm having a spell off the old diy.

good luck

Peter Scott

[<me9]

I thought of doing that, but the price of the individual cells cells made it just as economic to get a new battery. I'm ending up replacing the drill as well.

[Peter Scott]

Yes. When I bought a cordless I asked what the price of a second battery was. Only a pound less than the whole drill! I'm surprised that it isn't economic to replace them, but you've obviously done your homework.

Peter Scott

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Like everything else these things cost per item by the bulk they're bought in.

In theory, Ni-Cads can be damaged by soldering so factory packs are spot welded. Replacements are usually bought with 'tags' welded to them for solder connections.

Rapid electronics have a modest capacity tagged sub C for 1.60 each dropping through 1.50 for 10 to 1.30 for 500. ;-) Plus VAT. So for an 18 volt pack you're talking 23 quid. Best to make up the order to over 25 quid to get free delivery.

I've used their larger capacity (2 Ah) ones in the past at 1.75 per 10 and found them very good. Good quality cells can actually improve the performance of a cheap drill due to their lower internal impedance over the standard ones.

But it's worth shopping around the electronic suppliers to see who has special offers, etc.

[405 TD Estate]

Yes sometimes I run the drill until it can only just turn with the load applied (battery flat) - maybe this is bad. I can try putting the battery on charge after every job but I thought also Nicad's have a memory effect where if you don't completely discharge then they loose capacity which is why I would often run a pack into the ground before changing batteries.

It's a 1 hour charger with a 1 hour timer (for completely discharged pack) and also a thermomitor which switches the pack off when it starts to get warm, I did wonder how good this would be - will damage occur to the cells after they are full and are getting warm before the switch senses it? It also says dont charge below 5 degrees or something which I ignored and put them on charge in the garage where it may be a few degrees below 0 degrees on cold nights. Maybe I should put the charger in the house when it's cold?

Maybe but the RRP =A3180 Matika drill comes with 1.3 AH batteries. If I were replacing batteries I would try to use NiNH AA cells - available very cheap off ebay and capacities over 2.5Ah - would be a lot lighter than the Nicads and last nearly twice as long. Say =A315 to =A320 for 15 cells for 1 packs worth but I don't know how well they would recharge from the stock NiCad charger (dont know the differences between a NiCad and NiMH chargers)

[405 TD Estate]

I was lucky in that I got a new drill, 2 battery packs charger etc (and even a voucher for =A32 since the drill is cheaper now) and a new 1 year guarantee to go with the new drill.

But still I wonder if I would be better off spending =A3=A3=A3=A3 on a brand=

name drill whose batteries will still be v.strong in 1 year (or maybe they will be as bad as my argos drill?)

I think I will leave it at least another year since i'm happy at the moment

[John Rumm]

Yup, that will shag them fast. Run it til you start to notice a drop off in performance. Then stop. Also if you have been using it heavily then allow the battery to cool for 20 mins before charging.

If the charger is not a good design, then that may kill em anyway.

You really need a delta peak sensing charger for NiCds, with a separate thermal trip to detect fault conditions.

[Man at B&Q]

Have you got that in writing?

Replacement under warranty does not reset the warranty period.

MBQ

[The Medway Handyman]

I think you have answered your own question. Look at what you have for £35 - drill, 2 x batteries, charger, Argos markup - not much left for quality.

The Makita 8930 is a hammer drill.

> Other than this I am happy with the drill - 2 speed, brake, hammer

Makita batteries are 1.3 a/h but will be of reasonable quality & the charger is their standard 'smart' one, no worries about charging & they are fast.

[405 TD Estate]

I've got a new reciept with last weeks date on and it has a 1 year guarantee

[breeze34]

On Mon, 03 Dec 2007 18:51:09 GMT, "The Medway Handyman" wrote: snip

i have a 14v makita with 3ah batteries all three batteries were clapped out after a year

hth

breeze

[Peter Lynch]

In the past I've had a battery pack just stop dead. It was OK one second and gave nothing the next. When I took it apart I found that the cells were connected to each other with spot-welded metal bands. One of these had corroded through (and other ones were in a bad way). When I soldered a wire across the corrosion, and reassembled the pack (5 self-tapping screws) it was fine again.

[John Rumm]

I knew someone who had that happen as well (although when I asked about his usage pattern it turns out he was running the bats too flat and then charging when hot).

Full credit to Makita mind you, they replaced them all free of charge.

The 2.6Ah NiMh batts on my Makita 18V combi have been working well for three or more years now.

[Grimly Curmudgeon]

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember 405 TD Estate saying something like:

I do exactly this with my Makita cordlesses - the old Nicad and newer NiMH packs co-exist but I now have two chargers. The newest NiMH charger will quite happily charge both the Nicad and NiMH packs until each are full, but the old Nicad charger will only charge the NiMH packs about half-full, but that's not a problem as NiMH aren't bothered by memory effect.

If I'm using both drills for an extended session I just bung in whatever battery into whatever charger, trying to optimise the charging, but there's no disadvantage if it's the wrong way round.

[Grimly Curmudgeon]

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember Peter Scott saying something like:

If you shop around it's definitely worthwhile re-celling them with newer higher capacity cells, but then an old charger probably won't keep up. I did the same for an old 12V Bosch - new 1.2Ah battery packs were

100gbp - no way was I paying that. On digging around I found that a diy re-celling with 2Ah cells came to a much more sensible 30odd quid.

[Grimly Curmudgeon]

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember 405 TD Estate saying something like:

You could have a new drill every year if you keep that up. Just insist on a receipt each time.

[Man at B&Q]

You got a receipt for the exchange. I suspect the Argos computer system will know it was an exchange if you try it again. If not, then they're even bigger fools tha I thought.

MBQ

[<me9]

That's about the sum I got for re-celling. I could also get new packs on Ebay from HK for about the same. Not worth the hassle breaking the pack open and re-sealing for the coppers difference.