LED Bulbs Replacement

[Camdor]

Took the plunge and replaced my GU10 in the bedroom with 6 of these

I am very happy with them.

Now looking to replace some 12V MR16 in sons bedroom, as he doesn't seem to understand the concept of the off switch. ( was actually thinking of getting one of those push in timer switches you get in corridors to give a few minutes light before going off.)

Has anyone got any recommendations for 12MR16's. Spotted these on eBay, but from Hong Kong, so not sure

from the UK, but not a brand I am familiar with don't need to be dimmable. Unfortunately this house is full of recessed light everywhere, so am looking to get rid of all halogens, mainly for the cost of the electricity.

TIA

[ARW]

> They don't need to be dimmable.

If you were happy with the GU10 replacements then why not replace the MR16s for GU10s? Just remove the transformers and buy some GU10 lamp holders.

[Andrew Gabriel]

You will probably find LEDs don't draw enough current for 12V electronic transformers to operate. If you are happy with the lamps above, I'd pull out the MR16 holders and transformers, and replace them with GU10 lampholders (which are dirt cheap) and use the same lamps you've already found.

[A.Lee]

I've just fitted 20 Lumineux 4.5w MR11 (or maybe MR16) LEDs in an office, and they were a straight swap for the existing 20W halogens. In warm white, they were virtually identical in both brightness and colour. I paid £8.40 each for them. The 3W you linked to wouldnt be as bright as current 20W halogens.

Be aware though that they may not work with the transformer(s) you have now, they are low wattage, so some transofrmers may not go to such a low power output, the way round is to run 2 or more LEDs from 1 transformer.

[Terry Fields]

In the late summer I started a programme of employing LEDs in the house. The first lights replaced were four MR11s in the hall and landing. I bought premium lamps by Philips, largely because they were described as 'transformer tolerant' and I had no idea what lay behind the fittings. The lights are left on for most of the day form Autumn to Spring and could be expected to give good savings.

Next up was the study, used most of the day, that had 3 x GU10 spots. Philips 4W LEDs went in there, and I discovered that these also fitted the GU10s in the kitchen, whereas all other GU10s apart from halogen wouldn't fit in the holders; the same went for the utility room. Since then I've replaced every lamp possible with LEDs, probably totalling £200-worth. Calculations suggest that the savings over the costs of the original lighting will mean recovering the outlay in perhaps a year. Over the lifetime of the LEDs this will mean very significant savings, of the order of £100s due to the far shorter life of the halogens,

2000 hours compared to 25000 hours for the LEDs. Seen over that timescale any other type of lamp is a non-starter.

What does this have to do with your original query? Unless you can get specific recommendations concerning products from HK/China, I'd stick with a premium make as the payback time isn't that long and they can be expected to live up to their claims, such as 30,000 hours life and 50,000 switching cycles - information that isn't always forthcoming from HK/China sources.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

I'll be very interested to know how many of these lamps actually achieve their life. I'd a feeling it's simply a figure plucked from the air - same as so much with these sort of things. What is the actual warranty given?

[Andrew Gabriel]

Well ventilated fittings will probably make quite a difference.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Just Googled the cost of these lamps. About 15 quid a throw. As opposed to

1.50 or so for a quality halogen. So the LED actually costs more per hour of life than the halogen - even if it does last as claimed.

[Camdor]

I have yet to get a Halogen last it quoted life, The LEDs may be also not last quoted hours also, but it is the saving in Electric that I am most interested. All in, the LEDs will save money long term I believe.

[Camdor]

>>> They don't need to be dimmable.

Make sense, just trying to save work really, but have gone for the GU10 holders and ordered the same bulbs as before. That way everything will be 240V GU10's so makes replacements easier all round.

[Terry Fields]

But this is blinkered thinking for long term use.

Take typical numbers:

LED, 6W cost £15, 15000 hours life

Halogen, 50W, cost 69p, 2000 hours life.

Cost of electricity: 12p/kWh

Over the life of the LED it will use 15000 x 6 / 1000 = 90 kWh at £10.80

Over the same period the halogens will require 8 replacements at £5:52 and consume 50 x 15000 / 1000 = 750 kWh at £90.

Total cost for LED: £15 + 10.80 = £25.80

Total cost for halogen: £5:52 + £90 = £95:52

I have 10 LEDs replacing halogens, and over the (underestimated) life of 15000 hours can expect to save a total of ~£700.

This is not a trivial amount.

[ARW]

> >

Probably saving no work due to the transformer loading problem:-)

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Then don't attempt to hype it up with inaccuracies. ;-)

So will CFL or ordinary fluorescent. Or even changing from mains halogen to LV. And fitting a smaller wattage lamp.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

No it's not. I want facts, not misinformation.

hours can expect to save a total

You are assuming the LEDs provide the same amount of light and of the same quality.

I've yet to find any so called equivalent that does.

[A.Lee]

See my earlier post, I fitted a Lumineux 4.5W LED in an array of 20x 20W

12V halogens. It was that good that the manager couldnt tell which the LED was, until I pointed out the multiple points of light from the lamp, rather than the single point of the halogens. From this one sample, I got the job to replace all 20 at £7+VAT each.

These lamps are on 12+ hours, 6 days a week. Halogens, 20 x 20w x 12 hrs x 6 days x 52 weeks = 1497 kWh LED 20 x 4.5w x 12hrs x 6 days x 52 weeks = 336 kWh

assuming 10p/kWh, thats £149 against £33 for power usage alone. Clearly longer use, or more expensive electric would favour the LED even more.

The initial outlay was £200 (inc. labour), so after 18 months or so, they will have paid for themselves, that is not taking into account the number of halogens that keep needing to be changed as they have a short life.

[Terry Fields]

Yes, but your objection was on the grounds of cost, not quality of light.

When it comes to the latter I can get LEDs that can be variously daylight white, cool white, white, warm white, and very warm white. Halogens are, well, just halogens.

[ARW]

Who pays to swap the short lived LEDs?

I have only fitted a 1000 or so of them so far but they do fail far more often than you think they would.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Not so. I simply objected to a glaring inaccuracy. As there are too many surrounding this subject.

Yes - they are good at giving things names. Which mean little.

They produce a fairly natural light, so no need to attempt variations.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Quite. Their claimed life depends on them being kept cool - among other things. Simply swapping them into a fitting designed for halogen isn't going to guarantee the correct conditions.

[Tim Streater]

Right, well here's a fact:

I just installed 8 of these:

in our kitchen. They replaced 8 of the low energy jobs which themselves replaced 8 halogens

Well they do, as far as we are concerned. So kitchen lighting leccy use has gone down from 280W to 88W and then to 26.4W.

The main benefit AFAIAC is that I don't need to chivvy SWMBO about turning the lights off any longer.