lawyers probate fees

[®i©ardo]

Thanks for the information.

[Norman Wells]

The only people who have gained through house price inflation are those who owned property at the start and have since sold some or all of it, ie downshifted. There are very few of them. House owners may currently be showing a gain on paper, but it's in an asset they need to continue to own, so they can't crystallise that gain. For them, house price inflation is neither a gain nor a loss, it just is.

The people who benefit from house price inflation are those who inherit a house. But to do that, the decent thing to do is wait until the person dies. It's not very principled to say to grandma look how much your house has gone up, you should therefore give me any cash you've managed to save.

Then help your kids out of your own pocket, not out of comeone else's. And do the decent thing and stop hounding grandma like a slavering hyena.

[Bob Mannix]

I think you may have missed the point that Mr Noble is not the intended recipient of the money, so greed doesn't come in to it (on his part) whether you agree with him or not. As far as I can tell, he's trying to give it away. He is talking about a society where family is all, parents would (literally) die for their children and children would put their parents and siblings first without question. Such people do still exist but they are being squeezed out, like the red squirrel by the grey, and being replaced by self contained units of one person. It's "easier" to be such a unit but, in the end, hollow. Of course, even in such families, respect is all and you'll get out what you put in and support and love is given through choice, by grandparents or parents, or children. If you are in one of these camps, it is almost impossible to understand the other. Such is the nature of society today.

[stuart noble]

Well put. The single unit model we've imported from across the water is basically an economic system whereby everyone is important, permanently dissatisfied, and therefore permanently busy. Good for business to have everyone running in circles, but very bad for the participants (whoops, I nearly said "society").

[stuart noble]

You just don't get it, do you? There is no "me" or "mine" with family silver. It's looked after by successive generations and used prudently in the best interests of the group. Yes, it's a gamble, and a rotten apple can emerge but, on balance, it works and is the norm in most cultures.

And shut up about this bloody grandma of mine. She died in 1950 for chrissake. Yes, I battered her with a blunt instrument.

I wonder how the OP is getting on trying to rid himself of *his* leeches

[stuart noble]

I'm curious as to how they arrived at the figure 7. I guess they started with 1 and edged their way up to increase revenue without increasing the level of tax.

[Bob Mannix]

There was a tv programme last night, the first in a series where individual western young women spend time living in an entirely alien culture. It was very good and the young woman in question had many of the above ideas revealed to her through experience.

It was Maggie Thatcher who said "there is no such thing as society". I feel this wasn't merely an expressed view but a statement of intent, and an intention she achieved (notwithstanding things were going that way anyway).

[Andy Hall]

All of which was deliberately misundertood by socialists whose aim it has always been to create the illusion of an apparently coherent group of unrelated people in order to be able to exert collectivist control while having them believe that they are participating in some greater good.

It is an illusory notion, always has been and always will be. MT was simply pointing that out.

However, this is not the same at all as the family unit as described here, and MT was and is certainly in favour of that and its values, as would I be.

Equally, self-reliance is important as well because the individual can achieve more from his own efforts than by abrogating what should be some of his responsibility to others, be they family members or others. It is by that that the sum total of wealth (and I don't just mean in the financial sense) increases. Of course it is the case that some activities can only be realised by a collection of individuals working together... BUT (and it's a big but)... this does not mean that they are at liberty to contribute 70% of their ability and commitment on a group basis when they would have contributed 100% individually. We know the effects of that in so-called organised societies.

It's a matter of free will. As was said earlier, in a family it can be by choice. In a "society" it is by coercion and lack of choice.

[stuart noble]

I'll keep an eye out for that, but it's a feature of Busy Doing Nothing Britain that things you knew all along are presented as ground breaking research. You mean kids should be brought up by their parents? Wow, I'd never have guessed. Thank you Panorama.

Very true. And what a shining example her offspring are!

I wouldn't mind if any of this actually worked. All I see is stressed out parents and neglected children. The term "school holiday rage" might soon enter out vocabulary I fear.

[Bob Mannix]

Watch it first! It was not the point of the program, nor was it passed off as ground breaking research. It's a human interest serties about different cultures.

I fear the opposite. The "unit" demands a stress free life. Parenting is stress so it's avoided with inevitable results we see in the news. (I speak as someone who has identified his own mistakes, not as a preacher!)

[Andy Hall]

That's a different issue, which comes from people allowing others to be too much in charge of their destiny as opposed to themselves.

It always has been there and is the response to "I'm bored"

[stuart noble]

Oh dear. I hope you're wrong because avoiding stress is just so stressful. I've seen them marching off to the gym for their "me time" slot, hoping against hope that they're back in time for the bouncy castle delivery.

[stuart noble]

Being in charge of something is the easy bit. Making a good job of it is something else.

Bored parents rather than children usually.

[Robert Hunt]

OR they have given the Government more money to waste on their latest pet project that none of us want.

[Roland Perry]

In message , at 10:46:12 on Thu, 19 Jun

2008, Bob Mannix remarked:

You do realise those remarks were made in the context of people looking after their family members, rather than casting them out for "society" to pick up the pieces?