Its the sun, stupid...

In article , Nightjar writes

My point was they wouldn't have used metres in those days, so it makes the veracity of the article as a whole rather suspect.

So I'm still sceptical, even though Rod's link to Snopes appears to show it's true.

Reply to
Mike Tomlinson
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about 12,000 years ago.

But unlikely to be related to the density of the interstellar medium which is mostly too feeble to get as close to the the sun as Earth. The Voyager spacecraft are just about now reaching the edge of the region that the solar wind and radiation pressure can sweep clear.

Cosmic ray density might be modulated by our passage through the galaxy see for example:

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I am sceptical of their claims. YMMV

small degree it's mostley irrelivant to anything.

The evolution of the Earths orbital elements wrt perihelion (and in particular modelling predictions of average annual insolation at 70N) is the basis of Milankovitch cycles of glaciation. Snow pack feedback in Siberia and Canada has no counterpart in the Southern oceans.

Assuming you are serious the early Earth started out like Jupiter with a reducing atmosphere of methane and water. Only once photosynthesis got started did free oxygen appear. In fact seeing either of free oxygen in a reducing atmosphere or free methane in an oxidising atmosphere suggests a non-equilibrium indicative of life. That is why they are so excited about Mars where methane has been detected.

Oxygen is the polluting waste product of early life on Earth.

It is fairly stable, but it does have more than one attractor. The next one might not be anywhere near as nice for the UK. The global average temperature could go up whilst we revert to something nasty cold and stormy much more appropriate to our high latitude.

Reply to
Martin Brown

The report came from Norway, which adopted the French system in the 1870s.

Colin Bignell

Reply to
Nightjar

Indeed. But didn't most CO2 come from volcanoes, as on Venus? 90 atmos worth, in fact, almost all of which has been tied up in carbonate rocks (unlike Venus). AIUI, this process required water and life.

Reply to
Tim Streater

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

Sorry, I was talking about the laying down of carbonate rocks in the oceans by tiny creatures, not the volcano part.

Reply to
Tim Streater

That's what first made me suspicious although they didn't use metres they u sed meters which is American or non-european, I thought Americans or non-eu ropeans still used imperial measurements even today for such things, but ma ybe the writter of the column sotred it out for the reader.

Reply to
whisky-dave

Most of it almost certainly is from volcanoes. But until there was free oxygen there was a mix of methane and other light hydrocarbons as well.

Early photosynthesis was the ripping of water apart by a catalysts to produce energetic electrons and power life. Removing CO2 from the atmosphere to make organic compounds need not have arisen back then.

Crucial thing about the Earth is that we have all three phases of water present which provides a very powerful buffer on temperature changes and in liquid form is probably essential to the chemistry of life.

Actually you couldn't be more wrong. Pure carbon as buckeyballs, graphene, graphite and diamond are fantastically stable in the environment. The activation energy to make them react is very high.

Graphite and diamond are among the elements that occur in native form - and are extremely pure in the case of high grade diamonds.

Buckeyballs are so stable in fact that the first spectra of fullerenes were from the dust around young stars from astronomical observations whose spectra defied finding a terrestrial match for many decades. The surface is normally passivated and so very unwilling to react.

Only when they were made synthetically on earth by Kroto did astronomers identify cosmic dust by spectroscopic matching. It is ironic that anyone could have found them just by dissolving coal soot in benzene but apparently no-one did or realised the significance.

Reply to
Martin Brown

meters which is American or non-european,...

Not necessarily. I have a book of commercial tables which, from the postal rates must have been published between 1871 and 1897. The tables of Colonial and Foreign Weights and Measures shows that Germany used the meter as its unit of length, while France used the metre.

However, in this case, it was an American Consul, reporting the results of a Norwegian survey, so he would have used the American spelling of the foreign system. His full report, which goes into rather more detail than the newspaper article, is here:

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It points out that the changes had first been noticed in 1918.

This is a summary of climate change warnings from 1855 to 1980.

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In 1817, the President of Royal Society also reported to the Admiralty that the receding ice might make the polar regions more accessible than they had been for centuries.

There is this mention of a link between polar ice and sun spot activity, also from 1922.

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There is also this rather long article from 1933:

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Colin Bignell

Reply to
Nightjar

Ah.

Mmm. not sure that CO2->metal carbonates requires life either.. calcium carbonates perhaps..but sodium?

anyway carbon is extremely common in the earth in many forms from diamond to graphite and not all are organically mediated.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

used meters which is American or non-european,...

rather more detail but with no more meaning than we have today. Since the last ice age or rathern the age where most of Northern europe was covered in ice overv the alst 30k years. But as we all know it's warmer in britain than it was 30k years ago, and it's contiullly getting warmer or so we are told.

No I think the first time peole actually noticed was when the sea rose about

8,000 years ago creating the English channel and submerging I think some bronze age villages.

And centuries before then ?

There's many things that affect the weather short term, it's long term that what we need to know about.

Reply to
whisky-dave

Yes you can. Just factor in the dust blown from the central American states that practice forestry and you can match it to the hockey stick based on one unscientifically controlled weather station on the world's tallest chimney.

Reply to
Weatherlawyer

meters which is American or non-european, I thought Americans or non-europeans still used imperial measurements even today for such things, but maybe the writter of the column sotred it out for the reader.

Just got back from Austria (did I miss anything?) where they spell it meters.

Andy

Reply to
Andy Champ

They might but we don't.

Reply to
Tim Streater

used meters which is Ame

measurements even to

In German-language text or English? When they translate to English they mostly use American spelling.

Reply to
Bob Martin

Both

The quality of translations was in general not good enough for me to tell English from American.

Andy

Reply to
Andy Champ

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