I like wooden ladders for this sort of job. Made from rectangular timber they screw together into pretty much any shape you want. Sheds often dont stock teh extra long timber they advertise though.
NT
Now the next question is (supposing your tests come to the conclusion that what is described above is likely the actual arrangement) is what to do to fix it.
The traditional fix would need an extra wire between switches to carry the live from the upstairs circuit down to the downstairs light switch. Then you could do away with the jumper wire, and the feed to the upstairs lamp would be starting and ending from the same circuit.
If that is too difficult to achieve you could:
1) Disconnect the downstairs switch from the landing light altogether - have it just controlled from its own switch. (possibly opting for a remote control switch to return the capability of switching from downstairs)or
2) connect the upstairs lighting circuit to the RCD as well as the downstairs.Both have pros and cons...
(might be worth checking if the cable drops to the switches are in conduit or just buried direct in the plaster).
Photos please. If you do diagrams use lots of colours. I suspect a mixing of neutral wires, But a 30ma RCD can trip if theres 11ma leaking at the cooker, 11ma somewhere else (due to wires insulation aging) , and 11 ma somewhere else (due to mice)? [g]
Ok John, here is the latest.
I have disconnected the upstairs lighting circuit negative at fuse box, and the tripper no longer goes go off when I try the light switches..
So, this seems to confirm a borrowed negative from the upstairs light circuit..
..
Down-wires to all switches are set solid in plaster.
I see Two possible options.
...
Ah heck,, I forgot about thame pesky meeces,, there's not much in this house that they have not had nibbles on..
....
A fine piece of deduction, worthy of Sherlock!
2 looks good - if they are both just lighting circuits with modern low power bulbs in. The shared neutral will be OK then I think George (PS Neutral and Live, not Positive and Negative) ((PPS some say that the Neutral is also a Live!))
2 is the one I'd go for, unless you've got so much lighting wattage that its not workable. Not normally an issue if you're using CFLs.
NT
PPPS which is why we used to say Phase and Neutral, and now are supposed to say Line and Neutral.
So now you have a light that works and does not trip the RCD, go get something like:
Slap that in. Then your new working upstairs switch will carry on doing what it does, and the remote one you can stick to the wall downstairs, and also control it from there.
If he still has twisted rubber pair, taping bell wire to the wall might not make it much worse :) No, I'm not suggesting it.
NT
The young lad that fitted our central heating was/is a good footballer,, for the local team..
He did do his job fitting the CH, but with little empathy for woodworkng finesse,,
yup they can be a abit ruthless,wi woodwork..
Nevertheless ,he did leave a working CH system and a lot of creaky boards..
His work had to be checked and passed by somebody..
Delivery of goods required for CH instalation,,?
Well a pallet load of stuff arrived for the job an estimator had been in and set the requirements for the CH installation,,
I most likely signed for the delivery..
The delivery was not as should have been ,,
wrong size radiators were on the pallet..
The esult of a slightly wrong delivery was that we ended up with a radiator twice the size it should have been in the hall,,
The hall is where the house thermostat is located,,
This huge radiator can warm the hall very quickly and cause the thermo to switch the CH off long before the tiny radiator in the bathroom has even begun to warm that room or any other rooms desired temperature..
If there is traffic in and out of the front door,,
carers come in three times a day and any other time that I open the front door the Ch system responds to that. Because that is where the thermostat is..
CH for the whole house is booted up and well sometimes it is a bit warmer than it should be..
Or colder than it should be,, in other rooms,,
But the hall is kept at the temperature that the thermo is set at,,
I put towels on the too big radiator to try and reduce the speed that it can control the hallway temperature.
Tried to discuss this with inspector what passed the system ..
but he dint seem to get it,,..
Recommended i set the thermo much higher,,
..
A poor CH system that could be regulated better
in my view,,
..
However it came with a grant and that is what we got..
A Gas guzzler..
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Ive just been reviewing this thread
I tell you what John,
It is nice to be able to switch the upstairs hall light on when you have a downstairs loo ,,it works for the time being..
Sorry, but I do not fancy your slap in a remote idea,,
I feel that
In the absence of a new consumer/fuse box being fitted for financial reasons,,
Best solution is that the
RCD should be reconfigured to serve both light circuits upstairs and down ,,
And yes, I have taken on board that the braided rubber wire down hangers should be replaced..
Yesterday ,,
Last night,, my mother started asking for painkillers for a sore shoulder,, which is unusual..
with no obvious reason for the sudden onset of pain in her shoulder,,
However it was real,, So I did have to give her pain relief Co-codemol,, the strong ones,,
I had to go downstairs and look at them to remember what they were called..
What a Joy to be able to put the light on and see my way down the stairs instead of fumbling about in the dark,,
My hole in the wall was the easy fix taking the power from upstairs solved half the problem,
Rewiring the fuse box so that rcd applies equally to upstairs lights and downstairs is is a bit challenging I will admit, but. It is not beyond my ability now that I know what needs to be done,,
But it has been placed on the back burner for the time being,,
I might have to call in an electrician..
but for the time being I have other priorities to consider...
Thanks to all contributors of this thread
you have been very helpful..
Mike..
...
If you've got those then you've almost certainly got a lot of buried rubber wiring in a very bad state, and a wholesale rewire sounds overdue. Sorry to be the bringer of bad news.
it should be an easy job. Switch off fusebox power, disconnect 2nd 5A cable in box, connect to output of RCD.
NT
snip
just turn the valve down on the hall rad, not the TRV but the other end.
NT
Should it even have a TRV?
Maybe move the thermostat as well.
BG put a wireless one in for my sister and fitted it to the DHW cupboard plasterboard wall!
Tim Lamb wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@marfordfarm.demon.co.uk:
If it is in the same space as the thermostat it should not have a TRV - but I agree with the idea of closing the lockshield to slow this radiator down and give more heat to the others.
There is no control valve on the hall radiator,,
the thermostat is the control..
...
Do you mean there is not a tap at each end? If there is then one should have a cover. Remove this cover by pulling it off and close this valve - then start to progressivly open it about a quarter of turn at a time until the radiator begins to get warm. It may take several days to refine this setting - you are aiming to force most of the heat to go through the other radiators by throttling the flow o the hall radiator. Imagine if you have 8 radiators each capable of passing a gallon a minute of hot water. Imagine the pump and boiler can only pass 5 gallons a minute. Clearly the water will go were it will flow most easlily. The lockshiled valves are there to reduce the flow on the easy radiators to force the water to the others.
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