Indeed. Our camper has a plastic water tank. I admit the tea is a shade tainted if the water has been in there for 6 months, but it won't be full of bugs. You need air access for the spores, and time for the chlorine to evaporate, for that.
Then algae is what you get..not THAT harmful.
Which begs the question, why is washing up in a sink, even by soaking rather than rubbing much more effective when using hot water then?
It's not with foodstuff which contains protein (egg, porridge, custard, etc), which is why you start by washing them cold. OTOH, you generally don't have your washing up water anywhere near as hot as a dishwasher, and you do wash up by abrasion, so it's not so important as it is in a dishwasher.
Well hurrah for you.
The two points remain; water goes off and the rate at which it goes off depends on the nutrients available and the temperature. Mains water has chlorine or ozone or summat in it and it is lost from the water and it's anti-bacterial properties are reduced when the water is decanted.
Or does this not apply to you?
I can tell the difference between water that has been kept in a bottle for a day or two and water that has been put in the bottle the same day. Maybe I just smell better than you.
Sorry. DRV; double regulating valve. A valve designed for regulating water flow rates which, when adjusted, can be locked at that position. You can shut the valve & re-open it to the setting. Crane & Hatersley do them.
Needle valve, valve with small orifice for regulating small flows, not necessarily a double-reg valve. The orifice is liable to get blocked with scale particles.
Yes. The insulation just slows down the rate of heat loss/gain. In time it will get to the temperature of the surroundings. It reduces the rate of heat loss from the wall of the pipe, so that the entire pipe will get to the temperature of the hot water during a draw off, no tepid havens for bugs under scale and bio-films.
The more the merrier.
HSE website has details. It's a very common bacteria, only nasty if allowed to multiply and you then inhale an aerosol of contaminated water.
No. A story about copper alloys inhibiting bugs when used for door handles was on the CDA.org website and has become distorted. Copper/silver ion machines can, allegedly, but I've never seen one. Temperature regime is the best way to control it.
Flu-like, pneumonia, death. See HSE. It is in the mains water in small numbers and is not a hazard. It becomes hazardous if allowed to multiply ( tepid water + nutrients).
It's more the presence of dissovled oxygen in DHW which corrodes them
Yes. Shower pumps are usually limited to 60 degC because the impeller is plastic. .
There something on limits for notches and hole sizes & locations in a BS & most plumbing books. Near the ends is better than the middle.
8mm would be OK, but liable to clog; use 15mm.
I don't think his choice of aftershave is relevant here :)
More thoughts on this.
If legionnella will breed in a cold water tank in a hot loft when you're away on holiday, presumably it'll hang around under any mats or whatever of anything else that have grown in there. This means that once you have it, you probably won't get rid of it.
If you come back from your holiday when it's bred itself up to a dangerous level in the cold tank, you will be in danger *whatever* you do to your hot water system.
If the hot tank is set to a nice comfy efficient fifty, the shower will run on mostly hot water with a dash of cold, the bugs will go straight through the cylinder, and you have a problem.
If on the other hand you set the hot tank to a bug-killing seventy, the shower will use more cold to maintain the output temperature, and you'll be sprayed with a fair dash of cold bug-filled water, and again you have a problem!
Comments, one-tap?
Andy
It is in there, not usually at dangerous concentrations.
Keep the tank clean, no nutrients for them. The post-holiday infections are probably from minging domestic tanks.
Drain the cold tank when you return & bring in cold stuff with some chlorine/ozone in it.
You don't need air for the bacteria to get in, legionella is in the water mains. And in the hose you use to fill the tank.
Making tea with it is cheating. You need to drink it straight from the tank eo get the full benefit. And chew thoroughly before swallowing.
On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 11:17:33 -0800 (PST) someone who may be Onetap wrote this:-
Indeed.
The original claim was that, "If you put mains water into an opaque plastic water bottle, it will be noticeably whiffy inside 1 or 2 days." My experiment and those of others demonstrated that the claim is incorrect.
You neglect to mention that others have found the same thing. Are you claiming that you just smell better than all of them?
What do you make your porridge with? On our planet it's oats and water. Maybe milk if you're a wus :-) but it gets absorbed into the oats so much it doesn't tend to stick as egg does.
Umm, oats - which are around 10% protein (so far as I can find). Don't need any milk (though I like to add cold milk in the serving bowl). Can still stick something rotten. :-)
WRC or bylaw approved is obviously better and is the stuff to use for protecting pipes from freezing. The 'ecconomy' stuff reduces heat loss in hot pipes but doesn't meet any particular standard (AFAIK)
Yes, but the pump casing is iron or steel.
IIRC it's between 25% and 40% of the joist span for holes, something like
1/3 to 1/4 for notches, and limits on size and spacing of either. It's in one of the ADs (Building Regs docs) which you can find links to from the wiki.
Polymerisation (cooking) of protein in the oats is what makes porridge go thick. Don't think milk has anything much to do with it, other than as a medium to extract the protein from the oats. The more you cook the protein, the more it will polymerise (turn into a plastic) and become harder to wash off.
The statement is that;
1) water goes off and 2) the rate at which it goes off depends on the nutrient material in it and the temperature at which it is stored.Agree or disagree?
Do try not to get sidetracked by the plastic bottle illustration.
Maybe your subjective interpretation of the results is being affected by your wish to state that "I was right and you were wrong".
Maybe your experimental technique is faulty. You did not put my mains water in my bottle and you did not get me to smell it. Maybe my mains is contaminated or my bottles. Or maybe I do smell better than you. I do not care.
I usually have a bottle by my bed. If it is one or two days old, I can smell it when I put the bottle near my mouth. That is all there is to it.
I used to keep a glass of water by my bed; then one night I was woken up by the cat drinking from it.
No, I claim nothing. I state that I can tell one or two day old water by its smell. Believe or disbelieve as you see fit.
The chlorination of the mains water will have wiped out legionella.
If cleaned and disinfected properly then no.
Legionella infects through the lungs. you need an aerosol from infected water, as from a wet air conditioner, shower, or the flush of a toilet. Drinking it is extremely unlikely to cause problems.
Starch. Not protein.
Milk turns into casein glue and binds it even tighter.
>
Oh dear. You might believe that, but it just is not true.
The concentration of chlorine required to disinfect a water system of legionella would be toxic and would probably cause corrosion problems. There is legionella and other bugs in the mains water.
It is not cleaned.
Filling hoses, the system and the mains water have to be disinfected when filling commercial heating, heat recovery or chilled water systems or you will introduce bacteria that can cause problems, mostly pseudomonas aeruginosa, which can form persistent biofilms and clog systems.
Yes, but legionella is only one bug, of many, in the mains or in the environment. There are many others that will multiply given similar favourable conditions and will cause gastric problems. Drink untreated water that old and you'll probably get dysentry, at best.
In one case, drinking it is thought to have caused problems when it was vomitted/coughed up and the spray then inhaled. I think that was the most likely theory, rather than proven fact.
3)how much chlorine is in ot 4) the level of oxygenation, carbonation and the Ph. 5) access to airboirne spires and bacteria and teh liek 6).. 7)..8)...
Disgree you left out thousands of otrher factors that affect things.
plastic taints water. It does not render it bacteria full.
Sure, its not hard. I can smell teh water that's been in my plastic 400 meter long mains for a week,. When I turn the tap on.
However a bit of oygen makes it smell nicer, and it doesn'taste worse than anything else.
But in either case does it stick worse if you soak it in hot water rather than cold?
On Tue, 12 Feb 2008 12:34:43 -0800 (PST) someone who may be Onetap wrote this:-
That is a different claim.
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