hiring a stone crusher (or how to reuse old concrete)

[Fitz]

Hello all,

Glad to say the garden has benefited from a nice long easter weekend.

I've got a big pile of old concrete I've taken up from a knackered path that was cracking and ugly. I'm wondering whether I can save the money I might pay for a) a skip and b) 'crusher run'/bulk bag of hardcore for the planned patio by crushing all the left over concrete.

I've tried a couple of google searches for stone crushing and only got hits for large scale quarry plant manufacturers. Searches for 'Making hardcore' had predictable and unhelpful (in this context) results.

I've found one passing reference on this group in an old message suggesting that stone crushing is not a DIY task. Short of starting my own chain gang and smashing the lot with a trusty old sledgehammer I'm a bit stuck.

Any thoughts? I thought some kind of mini-roller based mangle type thingy on a trailer would be easy to hire for a day but certainly Jewsons have nothing of the sort. Maybe the potential for catastrophic 'ooo my gloves are caught' type injuries is too high for insurance to bear... or maybe I'm the only person who wants to do this.

-- Steve F

[The Medway Handyman]

A year or so ago I was at the Hirex/Interbuild exhibition and a stand near ours was showing a concrete crushing machine. Huge beast, towable by a three tonner I reckon. The idea was that old concrete went into one end and type 1 sub base emerged from the other.

The maths worked out well IIRC. It cost a whole bunch of money to hire the beast, but when you deducted the disposal cost of the old concrete and the purchase of the type 1 you ended up quids in. We saw one in use later opposite our office. They knocked down a building, crushed it & used the hardcore for a base.

I also know that, if you only fill a skip with clean hardcore, its about £25 cheaper. Apparently instead of the skip hire company having to pay for disposal, they can sell the hardcore to be recycled. A company called Gallaghers near Maidstone do it, so they take it there instead of to the dump.

Don't know if there is a DIY equivilent, but the technology exists. If its available to hire I reckon one of the big groups might have them, HSS, Speedyhire, Hewdons or Brandon maybe.

[Weatherlawyer]

If the old stuff was manky and you are fairly fit it won't take you more than 2 or 3 days. How overweight are you and do you prefer the relatively unhygienic provinces of a gym to work out in?

Once you build up the stamina in your arm muscles and callouses on your hands, using a sledge is just a matter of breathing and rhythm along with keeping your body temperature down.

Getting through the wall might take a week or so though, if you are not fit for manual labour. Buy a thick slab of knotty wood to pound it on.

[AJH]

I'd suggest a museum or stationary engine enthusiast, the last little one I saw working was at a steam museum in Devon, near okehampton IIRC.

It was much simpler than the big ones we see nowadays, a fixed vertical thick steel plate and a similar plate at a slight (20degree) angle to it and hinged at the bottom. A cam drove the top of this through a small arc, the stones gradually settled to the bottom and were crushed at the pivot.

One of the machines I drive is also a stone crusher but that has 3 tonnes of rotor with 45 tungsten carbide tipped teeth running at

2000rpm, it's quite good on flint, turning it to glass like shards but fails on granite and reinforced concrete :-(.

AJH

[Tim Lamb]

In message , Fitz writes

They exist but I doubt it is a DIY activity.

Clean rubble should cost less to dispose as it can be recycled.

Someone within the *North Herts. Farmers* buying group has one available for hire as they sent me some blurb. AFAIR you really need a Hiab with a grab to load your rubble into the hopper.

regards

[The Natural Philosopher]

I saw a crusher for hire at the hire place last year. It was NOT cheap..over a hundred a day plus delivery...a skip to take several tons is £75, free delivery..

WE traded our old foundations for a load of horse manure...the stud farm was building a new access road..what was left got buried under the garden with a 3 ton digger...;-)

[Rob Morley]

And those songs - you have to sing those songs.

[Weatherlawyer]

Naff C&W like Johnny Cash B sides?

Ideal. Or you could have a big breakfast and go shopping instead.

*******

"If I listened to the opinions of generals or military officers in the field, we'd never have had the success we've had in running this war. So, I'm not about to start listening now." Donald H. Rumsfeld.

(According to the Wikipedia he served in the U.S. Navy as an aviator and flight instructor. With a Distinguished Eagle Scout Award, he served as a puppet under Nixon where he learned all he knows about politics.)

[Ian White]

"... And he laid down his hammer and he died"?

[Fitz]

Thanks for all the replies. Looks fairly conclusive that the technology exists but is not designed for small scale projects like mine.

I might have a go with the sledge hammer and see how quick it is. In answer to one post my fitness is reasonable, I'm not at all overweight and gave up going to the gym a long time ago, prefering to cycle to work and go walking instead now.

I'm not sure finding a clean hardcore disposal type deal will save money in the long run because there's probably not enough to fill a skip and I've got lots of other crap to go in as well. Hiring one to get rid of everything is going to be cheaper than hiring two with a reduction on one because of the reuse of hardcore. IYSWIM. I could try swapping it with someone I suppose.

I've seen reference to differnt types of 'sub-base' i.e. type 1 etc. What do I need to know about this grading system in order to buy approapriate materials for a patio (and given that I'm a nosey sod who likes to know all the propoer terms for stuff).

thanks

[Rob Morley]

I was thinking more of the first track in "O Brother, Where Art Thou?"

[Chris Bacon]

It's not too hard to DIY it... Lidl even have a hammer that looks suitable for this for a couple of quid. Support the lumps on a pile of others, and start bashing away.... in a surprisingly short time, it'll all be little pieces! Use the big hammer for big bits, little one to reduce the size of them, as you can swing it nice and quickly!

Speaking from experience...

[somebody]

In message , Fitz writes

Hi,

I did the same last year by hiring the HI-C40 machine from TCP. GBP

120+vat day hire but I managed to wangle a weekend for a days rate. You need a fair amount of hardcore to crush to make it cost effective though. I did around 25tons over a weekend, loaded by hand. I estimate to have saved somewhere in the region of a grand by crushing rather than disposal and buying back.

their site they have (or atleast had) a video of the machine in action.

Hth

[Fitz]

will make some enquiries into prices and work out the most cost effective option.

cheers!

[Christian McArdle]

That's what I did. Put several nice beers in the fridge before you start. After crushing a path full of concrete, even Fosters could taste like the best beer you've ever had. However, it is feasible, at least for the big bits. I'd still buy some gravel in as well.

Christian.

[meow2222]

If you lift the crete with a bar first, and move it a bit before hammering down on it, it takes a lot less work to break.

NT

[meow2222]

I havent got the toolstation and screwfix cats to hand, otherwise I'd see whats the cheapest sds plus. I've not used one for crete busting, but if it were me I'd be very tempted if reasonable cost. Save a lot of work and end up with a nice tool.

Does anyone make a small wheeled breaker of the weight lifting type? It winds a big weight up, drops it, repeat and rinse. Be a sod if you got that on your toe.

NT

[meow2222]

I havent got the toolstation and screwfix cats to hand, otherwise I'd see whats the cheapest sds max. I've not used one for crete busting, but if it were me I'd be very tempted if reasonable cost. Save a lot of work and end up with a nice tool.

Does anyone make a small wheeled breaker of the weight lifting type? It winds a big weight up, drops it, repeat and rinse. Be a sod if you got that on your toe.

NT

[Grimly Curmudgeon]

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember Rob Morley saying something like:

"I get no kick from champagne..."

[somebody]

In message , Fitz writes

Hi,

Good luck with whatever method you choose. Many have recommended a sledgehammer and a few beers... to be honest I had thought the same (although it would have taken more than a *few* beers for 25 tons!).

You asked about 'type 1' and various 'gradings'. I cant profess to know anything about different gradings but can say that

and

give some good descriptions of how a sub base actually works. Bear in mind that for a proper base (such as compacted type 1) the 'material' is something like '20mm to dust' (pavingexpert does a good job of explaining why).

The HI-C40 crusher has adjustable output of minimum 20mm rocks up to about 90mm rocks and outputs the various dust and fines in between. When you see pavingexperts charts of the proportions of fines to smalls to rocks for a solid base you see why it is so important.

What I'm trying to say (whilst going right off course) is that sledge hammered hardcore does not a sub base material make :-) If you're putting down a few slabs for a path then it most probably doesn't matter

- chuck in whatever you've got. If you're putting down 60 sqm of patio on a hill where the slope means that one end needs over a metre of infill/base then it probably is critical (now you see where the 25 tons went!).

Hth Someone