Grand designs

Lime cement

So what have the gained from using this?

3 months to dry and a heavy price.

Pah! ecoligist are all me arse.

Reply to
George
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Indeed. And daren't do anything to in in case it cracks.

I LIKE portland cement. It works.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

It cracks bricks on houses round here.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Well there you go. Strong stuff!

I am all for sane ecological design, but here were good reasons why the Victorians abandoned lime mortar in favour of cement based mortar.

You can't just randomly cherry pick construction techniques on a 'green agenda' - you have to analyse the whole thing.

If it takes ten blokes ten times as long to make, and they all come by car...and van...?

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

I thought the wool insulation was very interesting, I just hate the rockwool etc, even the slabs (kingspan is a mess to cut arround services etc. But with the wife and kids installing the wool insulation with a pair of scissors I am convinced.

Has anyone used the product, gladly pay a price premium just to get over the awful mess, and if I can get the kids to do the job for some pocket money will more than make up for it.

Could this be part of the way to get a totally green house to gain the chancellor's zero stamp duty and easier planning permision?

Seriously, would welcome any comments on the product.

Reply to
dave northern lights

Thermafleece website says it has conductivity of 0.039W/mK, similar to rockwool.Celotex is around 0.023. I'm sure on the program he said the sheeps wool was around the best insulation you could get, but this is obviously not true, it's on a par with other fibrous materials, where the trapped air is the crucial factor. Simon.

Reply to
sm_jamieson

Its lovely stuff to use, you could curl up and go to sleep in it and its one of the few things that upland sheeps wool can viably be sold for these days

BUT

It is a LOT more expensive, like 7 times the price of rockwool. Thats a guess, I cant remember exactly how much but I know I fainted and gave up on the idea

I've not yet seen the latest Grand Designs - were they using it for loft insulation? If so, you could investigate a much cheaper and ecofriendly alternative based on recycled newpaper

Anna

Reply to
Anna Kettle

They were doing using lime-based materials all over their house. They went a Limecrete (not sure on spelling) screed, lime-based render on the outside, and even considered a strange polished lime-based internal finish on the walls. They had no end of problems because their builders knew nothing about lime. And didn't know anyone who did. Saw that and thought of you...!

The sheepswool insulation, although no doubt nicer to use than rockwool, seemed to produce a lot of dust. One of the kids was rubbing his nose and mouth at one point because of the obvious irritation. I really thought the kids should be wearing face masks. I think I would have done.

Jon.

Reply to
Tournifreak

Well yes. But we did this argument the last time.

Using limecrete wasn't stupid, mixing it with an Argos concrete mixer was stupid.

The sane thing would have been to ring up their local Readymix and say "we want 20 cubic metres (or whatever) of limecrete please." There would have been a delay while Readymix worked out what limecreate was, and where they would source the lime from, but then a lorry would have turned up on site and they could have poured it in a single day.

Reply to
Martin Bonner

Sounds good.

HTF can they justify that price? Is it some environmentally-cuddly price premium, or do they actually do something to the fleece between taking it off the sheep and stuffing it in the wall?

Owain

Reply to
Owain

Yup. Mix some Borax in with it, AIUI.

Reply to
John Stumbles

Thats the sort of thing that gives lime a bad name and its not the fault of the lime

Part of the problem is that plasterers get no training in using lime these days. All the college courses are centred around the skillset needed to plaster a Barrett box and none around the skillset needed to repair old buildings ... which is daft if you think about it cos there are far more old buildings than there are new ones but they dont have a champion with lotsa money to fund course development

And there is no getting away from it that lime mortar is not so idiot proofed as its modern equivalents and the average builder is a norful lot thicker than 50 years ago. All the bright ones have gone off to to do Media Studies at Yooniversity

Anna, feeling cynical this evening

Reply to
Anna Kettle

The sellers say it is all down to the economies of scale or the lack of it. Mind you there is only one producer in the UK so it could possibly be something to do with lack of competition

Anna

Reply to
Anna Kettle

Perhaps Barratt's boxes need more frequent repairs than old buildings...

Reply to
Colin Wilson

Am I correct in thinking limecrete is a new idea?

Although lime mortars have a very long history, pouring foundations into shutters with limecrete is new?

This would be hydraulic lime so doesn't need to air harden like fat lime (but does require non-freezing temperatures and gains full strength slowly)?

I was amazed how the architect didn't take responsibility for the advice given. She had steered her clients to a technique the customers had no knowledge of - and either she was also ignorant of the potential difficulties, or wasn't willing to inform them of the greater costs and timelines.

However if you do need an expert, these people are good

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ecofriendly insulation, AIUI Warmcel recycled paper insulation is cheaper.
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Reply to
dom

You could be right though I wouldnt guarantee it. Lime mortar construction is pretty ancient and you never know, poured shuttered limecrete might have been all the rage in 6thC BC Libya. I doubt if it went under that name though

Various people have been developing the technique for the last 5 years or so to try and get it suitably idiot proofed for mass production new build. IJP are in the forefront of this and will deliver to site in silos

Yup, but faster than fat lime

I am regularly amazed at how poor most architects are at what I think should be one of their main tasks - making sure that there is good communication between all parties; client, main contractor, subcontractors, council etc. They seem to think that once they have convinced the client to pay and done the drawings then all they are needed for is to make decisions when hitches occur in the build

Anna

Reply to
Anna Kettle

The prime requirement for being an architect is to be enthused with Grand Design Ideas and follow in the footsteps of all lauded architects, who like most artists, have to try something different in order to be noticed rather than carry out accurate detailed and thoroughly researched work to customer requirements.

You wanted Michaelangelo, you got Tracy Emin instead.. ;-)

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

I'm in complete agreement with both of you. I got through 2 useless architects on my chapel conversion project.

The first took off on a flight of fancy despite written instructions giving unambiguous priorities for a family home suited to self-build (dropped after doing 2 weeks work resulting in her telling me what I had already told her, part B wouldn't permit her design). The second had skills so lamentable that he had the greatest difficulty in getting any design passed by Building Control (on top of that he used my name as a reference to get work with a neighbour - who subsequently successfully sued him).

Finally I bit the bullet and did the design/drawings/structural calcs myself - and had a very smooth passage through BC with only the most minor queries.

Reply to
dom

I did the same by and large, asking the architect to merely make them conform to Building regs.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

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