Have seen a couple of semi diy programs recently, you know the sort.
Anyway I noticed what seemed to be some pretty flimsy bricks being used? Sort of thinner than UK bricks/blocks and hollow as well, about the height of a block.
Another one was some wiring they were installing, they were running it everywhere but where you'd expect, ie. diagonally across wall, around door frames etc. So much for the EU etc. we get the rules while they take the piss? ;-)
Mark S.
Always been that way. Italy signs up to all regs, but still does everything as they always did.
Dave
Sounds like the sort of bricks used and wiring done here (Turkey)...
Maybe from Eastern Europe?
I think that it's not European, but British regulations that control building work in the main, but I stand to be corrected... Also that we obey what the regs say, not like many other countries - no names, no flames...
"Mark S." wrote | Have seen a couple of semi diy programs recently, you know the sort.
"A Hovel in France / Spain / Italy / Wherever" sort of thing? "Whilst Tarquin supervises some quaint and characterful native digging out the septic tank to form the new swimming pool, our decidedly non-celebrity chef Wayne is cooking a traditional local dish of chicken marinated in mosquito urine..."
Owain
I noticed that too, maybe why I will never live in one of those places .........
However I do beive us Brits are a bit OTT on building control.
Rick
But still have the best safety records in Europe.
Yes, that's a good point! life is cheap in eastern europe!
I wish I had taken a photo of the workers I saw on a single board (30 cm wide) at the top of 15 meter high scaffolding recently...
Do you have a comparative source for safety records? I would be interested to see the effect of difference between e.g., British and Dutch performance on electrical safety, stair design etc.
For example the development of the typical Dutch house (narrow and tall) over centuries led to very steep and turned stairs being the norm. I live in a 15 year old 3 story semi which has these, which seem very unsafe to me but normal to the Dutch. When I discussed the issue the reaction was - so what is the problem?
Actually other parts of society are adjusted to the design so there is no problem, as I found out. I was bedridden 18 months ago with spinal problems, and had to be ambulanced to hospital. How to get down the stairs when I couldn't move at all? No problem, the ambulance crew said, it is quite normal for the ambulance to call up a fire crew to sling you out the upper floor windows. Indeed on close inspection one of the windows was specially designed to allow this. Preseumably in the Dutch building regs.?
The tool rental companies also hire out trailer mounted extending ladders that has a platform that whizzes up and down powered by a small motor. So moving house to the 3rd floor is not a problem, just rent one of these and away you go, all your gear effortlessly lifted without using the stairs at all. (The old row houses all used to have a hoist beam sticking out at the top of course, or provision to put one in for the day.)
Also the Dutch are great travellers of course, so many more cars over here have tow balls - and all the sheds have a row of trailers of various designs parked outside as well, also petrol stations rent them out.
I have a foot in both countries, and it is interesting to compare the difference in approach, but you also need to have an understanding of the background and surrounding systems and social environment. Maybe Dutch stairs are unsafe in isolation to a Brit, but to someone who has grown up with them, in a country where they are the norm and the surrounding systems are in place, maybe they are not...
Hence my interest in any comparative data. What is best and what is in the regulations is never a 1 to 1 relationship anyway in any country.
I even have a link on my desktop to a site where uncertificated people discuss how to modify the fixed electrical wiring in their houses without official approval! Consumer units , breakers and all!! Fortunately the government in the country concerned is going to regulate all that from next April. :-)
Cheers, Eric
AFAIK there are no regulations about the width of stairs, and turning is alowed provided going is still OK.
It is not so much a going but an ascent. Untrained british visitors are provided with a rope and iceaxe.
The stairs are far steeper than anything of relatively recent build in the UK, the only comparison I have is with an 1859 terraced servants cottage that had something slightly less steep. I might measure up tonight, but for now, can I describe it as follows;
4 bed house with two upper floors.If you stand on the 1st floor landing to descend there is a +- 80 cm wide top step. The stairs spiral away immeadiatly from this, at such a pitch that your first step down has to be on your right foot. If you led with your left you would have approx a 1m drop before you hit a step. The stairs are essentially a flattened spiral, which provides the only access to the two upper floors. (also they are polished wood with a bit of stick on carpet covering part of the treads)
Are (wooden) spiral staircases allowed as the only means of access to upper floors in the UK?
I and the family learned very fast to hold the handrails, and 1 person only on the stairs at a time. At no pint is there space to put more than half of my size 10's on a step unless I put my foot sideways.
Actually such steep and narrow stairs tread are not unusual. I know of a couple of restaurants which are split between the ground and first floor, and there are stairs that are so narrow that I can only put my heels on the tread. Gripping for the customers and more so for the staff carrying food up and down.
It seems also to be ok to have mains power socket right next to a washbasin so you can plug in your (unfused) hairdrier etc.
I would assume that there are more stair deaths and bathroom electrocutions in Holland than in the UK, hence the question for comparative data to confirm my prejudice.. however I know sometimes the facts can be different to what is "obvious".
Eric
80cm is only slightly narrow - I was imagining less.
To match with the polished wooden footwear?
That sounds like too small a going for the UK, and I now presume that is what you meant by 'narrow' Does the whole flight only turn through 180 degrees?
:-)
Measured up last night. The width at the top is less than I said, 58 cm to be precise. The stair turns 180 deg, but as it is built in a rectangular void the stairs are all different widths. The drop is 3.2 metres, and the horizontal length, if you measure down the middle of the steps, is about 1.4 metres.
The arrangement is identical to reach the top floor.
I don't know how this compares to uk regs, but it strikes me as a bit steep. And, as I say, I have seen steeper!
Like the old joke about the chap jumping off the skyscraper says, the trip down is easy, it is just stopping at the bottom that is the problem.
Cheers, Eric
AIUI the horizontal length down the middle should be slightly longer than the drop.
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