fence/hedge in tarmac

[Ben]

I have an area of tarmac next to a public footpath. There used to be a wooden fence but it was vandalised before I moved in and eventually pulled down by the council (even though it was on my land). I'd like to replace it, but don't much fancy the idea of digging up the tarmac to put new fence posts in (is it as much work as it looks?) and fully expect it would just be vandalised again anyway. The other idea I had was to drill big holes in the tarmac and plant seedlings in the holes to start a hedge, but I have no idea if this would work - how deep is tarmac usually, and is there loads of hardcore underneath? Which idea sounds least crazy?

[NoSpamThanks]

In message , Ben writes

I think I'd replace the wooden fence with a breeze-block/brick wall - more difficult to vandalise and anything the little wonders do to the other side won't bother you. The roots of anything planted through the tarmac are likely to damage more of the tarmac around the hole.

[Ben]

Hmm, sounds expensive. Also, they've done a pretty good job of vandalising some brick walls round here lately by throwing rocks at them

- huge bits fall off. I actually do care what they do to the other side, as I have to walk past it every day. I'd like to be able to see what they're up to without them being able to climb over. Hence picket fence with pointy top, or lowish spiky hedge. The house on the other side of the footpath has a hedge and it hasn't done the tarmac footpath any damage, although its planted in soil, not holes drilled into the tarmac.

[Ben]

If its that deep, it does sound like a lot of work. 120ft of fence with posts 6ft apart would mean digging 21 holes. Any idea what sort of price I could expect to pay for someone to dig the holes out and set the posts for me?

[aegxgea]

You could use a long pointed bar to go down through the tarmac and various layers total for footpath say one foot poss 18 inch.

[mike ring]

Ben wrote in news:412792bb$0$950$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp- reader03.plus.net:

Hence picket fence

From what theu do to brick walls of front gardens, and fences round here, I would say get a good hedge in if you can.

For some reason they seem less attractive to vandals, and there are some good prickly ones, I know of pyrocanthus, which is a real thug, and seems bulletproof as well, and the birds love it in autumn - (I had the care of one once), but I expect the good folks here know of some more evil species.

mike

[Owain]

"Ben" wrote | Hmm, sounds expensive. Also, they've done a pretty good job | of vandalising some brick walls round here lately by throwing | rocks at them - huge bits fall off. I actually do care what | they do to the other side, as I have to walk past it every | day. I'd like to be able to see what they're up to without | them being able to climb over. Hence picket fence with pointy | top, or lowish spiky hedge. The house on the other side of | the footpath has a hedge and it hasn't done the tarmac | footpath any damage, although its planted in soil, not holes | drilled into the tarmac.

It won't be cheap, but I'd suggest some type of industrial metal fencing - the sort used on industrial estates to keep scrotes out. One popular type has pressed metal verticals rivetted on to metal rails, set in either metal or concrete main posts. The rails are on the inside, and the verticals are pointy at the top, so it is very difficult to climb on/over, and because the verticals are convex and metal they remain rigid and rather painful if anyone tries bouncing off them. It's available in various colours, a dark green is fairly smart and visually unobtrusive. You could then plant your seedlings inside, you can get special biodegradable tubes for protecting saplings. Without a fence your saplings will get vandalised or stolen.

Digging holes - if you are in an agricultural area it shouldn't be too difficult to borrow or hire a Post Hole Borer.

Owain

[Ben]

I've been noticing a lot of that metal fencing around lately, it looks fantastic in terms of being vandal resistant and impossible to climb, but I don't think the neighbours would appreciate it and I think it is pretty expensive

Ah yes, I've seen them make quick work of fence post holes. Can they get through tarmac OK?

[Ben]

I was thinking of pyracantha, I've already planted some to stop them climbing over a low fence and its vicious stuff :-) I guess, apart from being spiky, the main attraction of a hedge is that its self-repairing.

[Joe Fogey]

You can get metapost type post holders that bolt into concrete. I don't know if they would work in tarmac - it might be worth a try.

Fogey

[N. Thornton]

seedlings wont survive any vandalism, but ready grown plants will, unless they pull them out before they root in.

To make a wall vandal proof, include plenty of galv iron wire in the mortar. Unfortunately the galv will rust and pull the wall apart after a couple of decades, stainless would be much better but I've never found the stuff yet. And of course use either dense crete blocks, or make a poured crete wall. Lightweight blocks are... lightweight.

Tall vertical iron railings are also pretty effective, and see through.

Regards, NT

[aegxgea]

My pointed bar idea was for a small hole to drop a root in.A few mins per hole.Work (planting) to be done oct/nov. To dig a hole for a good post (8 inch square by 2.5 feet deep) would take say a good hour in tarmac and hardcore. Min £15 per hole.

[Mike]

I don't know if it applies to private property, but we have been warned that if we plant a 'barrier' hedge such as spiky things, we could be prosecuted if anyone gets damaged or their clothes are torn etc etc in this PC world:-(( . This is in connection with a public path of over 130 metres long bounding a piece of land owned by the Parish Council.

Might be worth checking.

Mike

[Mike]

My Son-in-Law had £400 worth of hedging plants stolen just after he had planted them. He planted again and this time through wire netting just under the surface AND spray painted the plants a vivid colour so that 'IF' they were pinched again, a quick visit to the local car boot sales would be suffice :-))

They are now nice healthy bushes :-)) and of course the paint has either worn off or has been grown over :-))

Mike

[Ben]

Thats ridiculous, its only recently the police were saying don't use barbed wire, you could be prosecuted, use a spiky hedge instead! They'll be demanding a foam covered bouncy castle next. I'm seriously annoyed with the police round here at the moment. a small minority of them think its unacceptable to smash people's garden fences up, but the majority seem to view it as a civil matter and nothing to do with them. If I hear one more police officer say "there's nothing we can do" I don't know what I'll do, but I'll probably get arrested for it! What really takes the biscuit is a colleague of mine who's car was vandalised was told by the police that they don't chase after vandals any more, because all that happens is they just run away! Can I have my tax back please?

[mike ring]

Ben wrote in news:41285f54$0$37369$ [e-mail]:

In Essex they don't allow anything to interfere with their prime objective of being a complete waste of space.

I understand the various forces have a league table for it (along with motorway snooker)

mike

[Mike]

I go along with what you say, BUT, this is Parish Council property and we 'have' to look at all the problems which 'might' arise over any action we do :-((. The Council do have a £5m third party liability insurance, but don't want take risks whereby a claim 'could' be made by their negligence. How your household insurance would stand up I don't know.

Mike

[Ian Stirling]

Does anyone know where you can buy seeds for triffids?

[Leslie]

Have you thought of moving? because I doubt you will ever solve the problem, sad old world.

...............................Leslie

[aegxgea]

A lot of farm hedges will have to be removed if that were enforced.